We mostly hear of Ravana’s stories in association with Rama. Are there other stories?
There are several. These are not very popular but are found in the Uttara Ramayana. Ravana battles with the strong monkeys Sugriva and Vali who defeat him, tie him up with his tail and drag him to Kishkinda. There’s another character called Kartavirya Arjuna who has 100 hands with which he makes a dam to stop the flow of water. In a battle, he defeats Ravana. Vali is defeated by Rama and Kartavirya Arjuna by Parashurama who is then defeated by Rama. Whoever defeats Ravana is defeated by Rama. This shows that Rama was a greater warrior than Ravana.
Ravana tries to convince Sita to become his queen. He tells her he loves her and would shower her with all his wealth and prosperity. When Sita refuses, he gets angry and says she would never be able to meet Rama without his permission. No one will be able to enter or leave Lanka without his saying so. He says, ‘I am being good by behaving nicely with you.’ Sita scoffs at him and says, ‘Kidnapping a woman is hardly civilized behaviour.’ Ravana tells her that he could easily drag her to a mandap and marry her by force, but he would rather she did so willingly. He could easily have destroyed her beauty that had so attracted him.
Did Ravana ill-treat Sita?
No. In the story, he keeps her by force in his house, in Ashoka Vatika, but never abuses her physically. There are many reasons for this. He was cursed that if he were to touch a woman against her will, his head would burst. Another story says that Sita keeps a blade of grass and tells him that if he were to cross that, he would die. So there are many boundaries. In Kamba Ramayana, Ravana falls in love with her and wants her to come to him willingly. That would be the ultimate victory for his ego. In a way, Sita’s heart is a battlefield for him, one to defeat Rama. He does not win here also. He has everything—wealth, power and good looks for which even married women abandon their husbands—and yet it’s not enough. Saam, daam, danda, bhed (negotiation, bribery, force, division)—nothing works. He even uses magic and shows Sita Rama’s head and says he’s dead, hoping that she’ll then come to him. But she turns him down again as she is a pativrata. That hurts his ego. This is to show the psychological battle of egos in tandem with the physical war against Rama. The people, though, don’t believe Sita. When she returns to Ayodhya, they raise doubts about her character, showing society’s dark side. In a way, Ravana destroys Sita’s life.
Rama is said to feel repentant after he defeats Ravana. Why?
Karma is karma after all. Even if you are a Kshatriya and have killed your wife’s kidnapper, violence is violence. Moreover, Ravana is a Brahmin. In India, Brahmahatya (killing of a Brahmin) is supposed to be a paap (sin). In ancient times, knowledge was not written down. You had to learn the shastras by heart, which the Brahmins did. To kill a Brahmin was like burning down a library. It was a sin because all knowledge would be lost. This was a kind of protection for them. Rama was guilty of this sin too. He was a Kshatriya, hence lower down in the caste system than Ravana. In the story, Rama asks for forgiveness for killing a Brahmin. By killing the negative side, the positive side has been affected. There’s a famous folk story in which Rama tells Lakshmana to go and acquire knowledge from Ravana because when a man dies, his knowledge dies with him too. When Lakshmana goes to him, he is turned away. Lakshmana tells Rama that Ravana is too egoistical to share his knowledge. Rama asks him where he was standing when he asked; was it at his head or feet? When Lakshmana says head, Rama scolds him and says, ‘How do you expect to gain knowledge by standing anywhere except at the feet of your guru? He may be a villain, but our enmity is now over. He is now a guru from whom we want knowledge.’ Rama sits at Ravana’s feet and says, ‘I have defeated a villain but I respect Vishrava’s son, so please give me your knowledge before you die.’ Ravana breaks down and says, ‘I realize your greatness now. My ego did not let me see this till now.’ He gives him one piece of wisdom—that in life, evil attracts us and we run away from goodness. The backstory is that Vishnu lives in Vaikuntha which has two sentries—Jaya and Vijaya—who are cursed to be born as rakshasas on earth. Ravana is one of them. By killing Ravana Rama is doing his uddhar (upliftment) so that he can return to Vaikuntha. More knowledge gives a story a different perspective. It’s about more than just a hero, Rama, killing a villain, Ravana. In fact, Ravana shows viparita bhakti (‘paradoxical’ devotion). He is a sentry asking Rama to release him from his rakshasa life and to force him, he abducts Sita. It’s not lust that drives him; it’s a form of bhakti. If you see it from another point of view, the same story seems different. This is a very important wisdom from the Puranas. In the light of eternal knowledge, Ravana has negative and positive qualities. He is a bhakt, dwarpal, Lankapati—but despite all his knowledge of the Vedas and his devotion to Shiva, he does not see that Rama is a god. Rama does not hate anybody. He watches calmly as Ravana’s ego-driven actions create a big saga that is the Ramayana.
I’ve heard that there are many Ravana temples in south India. Is this true?
Ravana is a veer so he is worshipped. There are small temples in Madhya Pradesh (Ravangram Ravana Temple), Uttar Pradesh (the Ravana temple in Bisrakh) and Rajasthan (Jodhpur Ravana Temple). Some communities claim a relationship with Ravana and believe that Mandodari was their daughter; some believe they are his descendants. There are some Shiva temples believed to have been established by Ravana—Gokarna Temple in Karnataka and Kakinada Temple in Andhra Pradesh. These have Ravana idols. In fact, Shiva temples always have an image of Ravana because he was a bhakt. We should learn from the story of Ravana that one may be educated and capable but still foolish. We don’t respect women. When a woman says she’s not interested, she’s not giving you consent. So no matter how much you love her, you should let her go. Let her live her life. The Ramayana is trying to say that the Ravana inside us, who does not listen to women, should be burnt.
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Khajuraho Temples
Khajuraho is always associated with erotic sculptures. These temples are cited as examples to show how broad-minded and progressive Indian culture is. What is the meaning of Khajuraho? Has it been taken from the word ‘khajur’ (date palm)?
Yes. Three possible meanings are ascribed. It is said that there used to be gold date palms here. Some say it is related to the scorpion which was associated with Shiva especially in tantric puja and some mischievous ones say it is a metaphor for male sexual desire.
When were the Khajuraho temples built?
The temples are 1000 years old. It must have taken 300–400 years to build them during the period from the ninth to the twelfth century. In India, houses were made of mud. So upon destruction they merged with the earth. Devalaya or the house of god was made of stone and only that is now left behind.
Whose temples are these?
There are three or four groups of temples. The biggest temple is called Kandariya Mahadeva. It is a Shiva temple inside a cave. There’s a Vishnu temple, Ganesha temple, Surya temple, Chausath Yogini Temple of Shakt parampara and also temples of Jain parampara.
Jains were mostly sanyasis. But Khajuraho is generally associated with erotic sculptures. Why?
Today, we separate the erotic and the ascetic aspects of life. We never did that earlier. Our shastras said that to give life meaning, we need to consider many aspects. The purusarthas (goals of human life) were dharma, artha, kama and moksha. In Jainism, moksha has been given a lot of importance, so they have many idols of meditating monks but there are also idols of dancing girls and sculptures depicting music and dance because they understood that there are all kinds of people in the world. Jainism has both the Shravan and Shramak paramparas—one who has given up life and one who lives in society. So there’s always acknowledgement of the other. In Hinduism, bhog–vilas becomes the central theme where dharma, artha, kama and moksha are all given equal importance. At Khajuraho, sure, there are many erotic sculptures, but maybe one in ten. Why are temples built? For the Jains, the devalaya is for the Tirthankaras. A temple is a symbol of Brahmanda w
hich has everything—dharma, artha, kama and moksha. A world is created from stone. The garbhagriha is for the god. The Bhagavad Gita has the terms deha (body) and dehi (atma). Similarly, a temple has a god. If you look at the art and architecture of temples carefully, you’ll learn a lot. All the temples in Khajuraho face the east so that the first rays of the rising sun fall on the god inside the temple. All the temples have been built on a platform (adhisthana). There are no walls. Perhaps nobody attacked them then, so they were not afraid of anyone. All the four corners of the platform have temples; the main temple is in the centre and has a maha mandap, a mandap and a garbhagriha on which there is a shikhar (pinnacle). The shikhar and the walls have many carvings—flowers, geometrical patterns, animals like elephants, horses and yaali (head of elephant and body of lion), male and female bodies, kings in battle or at shikar, gods and goddesses, household scenes, etc. It’s like a photograph of life. Men are beautiful with soft and delicate features and women are happy and comfortable applying make-up, wearing jewellery, bathing, combing their hair and also having sex—shringara rasa. And they are not looking at you. You are looking at them as if you were peeping Toms. When the temples were built, society was probably different. Women were confident and respected. They were comfortable with their bodies and desires and all this shows in these sculptures. It is as if she is asking the man to pleasure her—I want bhog, sukh, samadhan. The pairs are not just male–female, but also male–male and female–female. Gods and goddesses look into each other’s eyes and talk to each other. In one place there is a navagraha idol depicting time. In another, the concept of space is depicted by statues—Ishana (facing north-east), Kubera (north), Agni (south-east) and Indra (east). There are sculptures of kings sitting on elephants or thrones, depicting dharma. Images of merchants in a discussion and a caravan arriving in the city show artha. Kama sculptures show romancing couples—Shiva–Shakti, Brahma–Saraswati, Vishnu–Lakshmi—lost in their own world. If there is freedom to love it means it is a happy kingdom. This was the beginning of Buddhism and people had started talking about renunciation of this sorrow-filled life. Some kings and rishis felt that there should be a counterbalance to this. So they show gods enjoying sensual pleasures. People visiting the temples realized life had all the pleasures. All the sex positions—male-dominant, female-dominant, mutually pleasurable—are depicted here. Not all are at eye level. Some have been built so high that they would not be seen at all. They are meant for the gods—to show them that in our kingdom, we are prosperous, happy and well-loved.
There is a story of Shiva–Shakti associated with the Kamashastra. Shiva tells Parvati that their love is the union of purusha and prakriti and this is why the balance of the world stays. He tells her that it is their duty to sustain and foster this union and that their love is unmatched.
This shows how the Kamashastra originated from Shiva–Shakti. It’s literal—pleasure between man and woman—and metaphorical—between purusha and prakriti.
Are the Khajuraho temples associated with the Kamashastra?
The Kamashastra was written 2000 years ago. The ancient texts were the Dharmashastra, Arthashastra, Kamashastra and Mokshashastra. The Vedantasutra and Upanishads fall within the Mokshashastra. As does the Jain religion. In those times, moksha was not given much importance. People thought they would think about it in old age; dharma, artha and kama were considered more important. In the Kamashastra there are several compositions. Kokashastra by Vatsayana is the most famous one. It is said that it all came from Shiva. After Shiva and Shakti get married, Shakti asks him how a husband can keep his wife happy. Nandi listens to their conversation and passes it on to humans through writers like Vatsayana. The Kamashastra is 2000 years old and the Khajuraho temples are around 1000 years old. Through their sculptures, they depict the concepts of all these shastras. If you read the Kamasutra, you’ll find that only 20 per cent of it is about rati krida or erotic activity. The remaining 80 per cent is about relationships. In fact, it’s quite a boring book. It reads like it may have been written by an engineering student. It’s not an erotic book. It’s a scientific treatise. It’s not about bhog; it’s about contemplation. There’s one piece describing who is a rasika, how he dresses, how he should live in a city, wear perfume, how he should decorate his house and how he should talk to girls. There’s one chapter on how to behave with wives—the chief wife, junior wife, etc. If you are in an extramarital affair, how do you behave with another’s wife? How do you behave with the cupid who brings you together with your lover? There are chapters on massages, aphrodisiacs, magic and the sixty-four ways of making love. When you read it, you’ll say, ‘If we think so much, where will the love go?’ So this is a very technical manual. Many artists have portrayed it in paintings, particularly kings’ artists, but that is not the Kamasutra. These paintings are 300–400 years old. The Kamashastra is 2000 years old. It’s a highly technical book. But the sculptures in temples are not. There’s rasa and bhava there. Young students who finished their studies in ashrams were brought to the temples to show them the ways of the world, how to treat women, how the kings and warriors lived, their durbars, shikars, battles, private quarters, etc. Another theory is that the devadasis used to stay in the temples and this was their advertising board to show that they would teach the boys how to treat their wives. Ibn Battuta, a Moroccan traveller and scholar who visited India in the fourteenth century, has written about these temples. He says that when he visited, which was 1000 years ago, women here were relaxed, did not wear purdah or ghunghat (veil) and wanted their men to keep them happy. It was not a patriarchal or male-dominated society. Women were treated well and the men were anxious about their ability to keep their wives happy, so they visited the ganikas to take training. Nowadays, we’ve become so scared, so puritanical, but earlier kama was just one aspect of life. And they were not just talking about duty but also about happiness. This is what the temples depict. There is god inside so it is about the Mokshashastra (liberation doctrine). There is Vishnu, Shiva, stories from the Ramayana, the Mahabharata and also the Mokshashastra. That is the wonderful thing about Khajuraho.
Is there anything unique about its architecture?
There are two styles—one Dravidian and the other Nagara. A high level of geometry is used. For example, from a square base, the building rises into a circular form. This is called the Nagara style. If you move a square 10 degrees at a time, it slowly forms a circle. That’s how the temples have been built. And every piece has a sculpture of a god or goddess or a life incident. All these small pieces of sculptures add up to a temple. The whole is beautiful; so are the parts. Your whole life is beautiful but you can bring beauty to every moment too. Make your life like the temple. But deep inside there should be god.
Are the Khajuraho temples tantric temples?
Khajuraho has the Chausath Yogini Temple associated with tantra in which the body is used to achieve moksha or siddhaprapti. Sexual activities are part of the rituals. So are madira (alcohol) and mamsa (meat). These would clash with the Vedic parampara which is about sanyasi practice where you stay away from sensual pleasure and follow the nivritti marga. The tantric tradition is about pravritti marga which uses the senses to reach god. In the temples, perhaps this was spoken about too. Sex can be seen through four prisms—dharma, artha, kama and moksha. Dharma would be sex for reproduction. Artha would be about devadasis or courtesans who have sex for money. Kama is only about pleasure, which includes music and dance, while moksha is about tantra, which includes siddhi and samadhi. This may be related to the Chausath Yogini Temple but there is no concrete information about it.
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Yoga
What is the meaning of the word ‘yoga’?
It’s ‘yog’ in Hindi or Sanskrit. In English it’s spelt as yoga, thus the different pronunciation. But it’s the meaning that’s important. It’s difficult to say when it originated. The 5000-year-old Indus Valley Civilization had seals which depicted people sitting in Bhadrasana or throne position
. Did the people know about yoga then? It’s hard to prove or disprove.
In the Rig Veda, the word ‘yog’ is used, but the meaning is different. The word ‘yuj’ means to harness or join or bind bullocks to a cart. This meaning later becomes associated with yoga. The Vedas also use the word. So did they know about it? Perhaps.
The word is mainly associated with the Shraman parampara, which is the world of vairagis and sadhus—ascetics. Before this was the yagna parampara which contained a lot of rituals. Shraman parampara believed not in the rituals of the outer world but in the reflections of the inner world. These ideas took root 2500 years ago when the concept of moving from the physical to the psychological world emerged. That’s when the talk of yoga began. It took about 500 years of practice and discussions by sadhus and yogis to become a shastra or science where the ideas were organized. Yoga science (yoga shastra) came together with the practice of hundreds and thousands of people over hundreds of years.
What was the first understanding of it? How was it described then?
It is about the relationship between the physical and the psychological world, about joining and harnessing these two. Consider the bullocks the physical world and the cart the psychological world. For the cart to move the alignment has to be perfect. The broad meaning of yoga is alignment. We complicate it unnecessarily.
Yoga shastra must be having classifications. Were there different schools of yoga?
There are three or four books that are highly regarded in yoga. One is the Bhagavad Gita which is 2000 years old and believed to have been told to Arjuna by Krishna. Second is the Yoga Sutra composed by Patanjali which is 2500 years old. Third is the Yoga Vasishtha which contains the knowledge given to Rama by Vasishtha. In the Nath tradition, we have Gorakh Samhita which has the teachings of Gorakhnath. This goes into great depth of what siddhis are, how to attain siddha and its relationship with yoga.
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