"We waited and the psychiatrist came and of course he had to be hospitalized, so they took him to Central Islip and it is probably now eleven or twelve o'clock at night.
"A psychiatrist began to talk to him there and said, 'Do we really need to keep the handcuffs on?' and the cops said, 'You don't know how strong he is—it took a lot of us to get him down to the ground.' But the doctor said, 'I trust him, he seems calm now, let's give it a go,' and they took the handcuffs off and then the doctor said to the cops, 'It's all right, we'll keep him, you can go.' And they left.
"And then we sat and talked and the psychiatrist probed with me into some of the background and I explained that the death of his father had been very disturbing to Jay and he had never, in a sense, shown in a way, like his deep emotional feeling, like he was, again, trying to hide it.
"It was difficult, perhaps, for him. Because in our household, like there was this bit about a stiff-upper-lip kind of thing that even I, perhaps, could not help him to be able to show his emotions.
"Now, when Mr. Hayes, Jay, and I were at the motel, I had phoned Jeff, realizing it was probably putting a burden on him, but I personally felt that I did not have a husband and I wanted to talk to somebody who had good sense and also because I knew that he would be concerned.
"I called Fort Bragg and when the phone was answered it was answered by Colette and I explained that I did not mean to upset her in any way, but that I called to speak to Jeff because we were having a little problem with Jay.
"And she said he was not there. He was on maneuvers or special detail down in Puerto Rico, but she wanted me to tell her about it so I said, 'Well, Colette, I think Jay has probably taken a bad dose of something and he seems a little out of his mind right now and I am getting professional help for him, but I just wanted to talk to Jeff because he had such a quiet, nice mind that what he can do is ease me a little bit. But it's not necessary and please don't burden him with it. And she said, 'You know
Jeff—he loves Jay and he would be very concerned and I think he should know.'
"I learned later that Colette got permission to call through on the field telephone where he was on maneuvers. He then got special permission to leave Puerto Rico and come up. He arrived, to my recollection, the very next day."
"What was he dressed in?" Victor Woerheide asked.
"He was dressed in his full military garb. You know, a Green Beret wears his beret and he wears a uniform and he has boots on."
"Did he bring any other clothing with him?"
"Well, interestingly enough, I can only remember him in the uniform for the entire time he stayed there. In fact, even when we visited Jay at the hospital, which was several times—and Jeff spoke to the psychiatrist many times—he was always dressed in his military garb.
"Jeff told me that he reviewed with Jay how it happened, who gave it to him and the answer was always that it was just some guy who was selling the stuff. Then Jeff was discussing the fact that Jay was mostly concerned with impending death because he had watched his father die. He was with him during the last hour."
"Was Jeff there also?"
"No, Jeff was in Chicago. And the thing that distressed Jay was the absence of color in the body following death, plus the fact that there was excretion, probably semen or urine, which is a very natural thing, but to him it was frightening. He had never talked about this to anyone but he was able to relate it to Jeff, and Jeff explained the process of death to him.
"Now on the day following, Jeff asked the doctors how they thought Jay was doing, and they said they did not think he was psychotic, but that he'd had a very bad drug reaction, and he said, ‘We think we should be able to release him tomorrow, but we must caution you that he is going to have bad flashbacks and we have him on Thorazine at this time and he should be maintained on Thorazine and he should get this kind of a dosage,' and so forth. 'And if he gets in trouble, occasionally, if he gets the same feelings—and we have discussed this with him—he should not panic, that it will probably pass. But he should be maintained on Thorazine.'
"At that point they told us we could come for him the next day and we took him home and Judy had prepared a lovely supper. She had things cheerful and nice. Jeff said it was time for him to go and what they would do was go back to New York and then Jeff would take off from New York to return back to his base. But he would see that Jay got back okay. He wanted to see where it was that he worked. And that was the last time I saw them as brothers together, when they left to return to New York." ~
"Was Jeff ever violent? Did he ever, in your presence, strike anybody?"
"No. I mean, as kids, he and his brother would wrestle occasionally. Things like that. But no. I think Jeff dislikes disorder or chaos or violence or disruption. He is by nature a lover of beauty and harmony and peace. I think most people find him to be a delightful person to know. I have never known him to be abusive. He likes to keep things serene.
"As a result his nature as a baby—he was, you know, the kind of kid that even when he woke up from his sleep he had a grin from ear to ear. I must confess that I thought he was kind of a little slow mentally at first because he was just so happy all the time.
"He had a wonderful, sunny disposition. And he was a very amenable child. Responded—like for instance at Christmas in order to make it look like you were getting a lot of things, you'd slip in things that were absolutely needed, such as a flannel shirt, or underwear or whatever, and when he opened his presents he was always very enthusiastic. You know, 'Just what I wanted!' And you'd laugh because it might be two sets of underwear. It was like a filler present, you know, but still he responded to it. He was always—he had joy and he brought joy to lots of other people."
Woerheide then asked about the relationship between Jeff and Colette.
"Like every couple," she said, "there were times when I'm sure they were a little hassled, but it didn't seem to be anything. They looked like they were truly very much in love."
"Now when you were visiting them at Thanksgiving in 1969, * I take it Colette knew she was pregnant again?"
"Apparently."
"What was her—"
"Reaction? She seemed very pleased. Now, I was a little upset, I must tell you. I didn't say this to her, but I felt that because of the difficulty of her pregnancies, that you know, it was kind of, you know, maybe they ought to at least give her more time.
"But she always wanted a large house with a lot of children, dogs, and horses. I mean, it was sort of a dream of both of them to be able to live in a place—like they often talked about living in Vermont or someplace of that nature where they could enjoy, in a sense, a natural existence. You know, space, children, and animals.
"So when I embraced Colette and asked how she felt about it, she said, 'I am very happy. I know that it will be okay. It is probably a little soon, but it will be okay.' "
"When you visited at Thanksgiving, where did you sleep?"
"I slept with Kimberly."
"Was it Kim's idea that you sleep in bed with her?"
"Yes. We had kind of a special thing. Kim and I always—we kind of looked at each other and grinned. I can't describe it to you otherwise, but when I came it was always, 'Nana, you know you sleep with me.' "
Dorothy MacDonald then, for the first time, lost her composure to the extent that she began to sob.
When Victor Woerheide resumed his questioning—his inexorable, inevitable, unavoidable questioning—his voice was unusually soft.
"Was there any problem as far as bed-wetting was concerned?" he asked.
"I don't think Kimberly was bed-wetting any longer, but I'm not sure of that. I didn't live with them that long." "When was the next time you went down there?" "Just prior to New Year's." "How were they getting along?" "To me, it seemed very much the same." "Any problems? Any tensions?"
"If there were tensions, they were not obvious. There was no overt fighting, the conversation was normal and routine. I remember what we did—New Year's Eve we went fo
r dinner with a group of people, and I went home early and relieved the babysitter and they stayed out to dance. To my observation it looked like a normal, happy married couple who were having a New Year's Eve out with friends."
"Did you ever help around the kitchen at all?"
"Oh, yes. At Thanksgiving or even the next time, yes, I would always be helping. Either setting the table or helping with the meal. I remember, inadvertently, I had thrown away the makings of gravy for little meatballs that Colette was preparing for hors d'oeuvres, and I felt very badly about it.
"But I told her, 'Hey, kid, don't sweat it because I have a little secret recipe that I can sort of concoct.' And I got out some gravy mix and some onion soup and, well, you know, put
together a gravy base and put the meatballs in it, and kiddingly I said to her, 'It'll be the hit of the show.' She said, 'Okay, I'm glad we were able to recover.' And so we put out all these hors d'oeuvres for the people, and it was satisfying and she laughed and said, 'You've done it again.'
"Do you remember that they kept things like Popsicles in the freezer for the kids?"
"Oh, yes, that would be a common thing for them to do."
"Well, do you remember specifically any of the household utensils? Speaking of, for example, an icepick?"
"Sir, I've gone over in my mind a million times. May I answer that? I can't. I would not be able to identify anything."
"Well, in the freezer things have a tendency to frost up. Do you remember using an icepick—"
"I had no time—not no time, I had no occasion to use one, to my recall."
"Do you remember when they were preparing drinks, let's say, at Thanksgiving, that Jeff went around looking for an icepick? As a matter of fact, he went out into a shed in the back to look for an icepick."
"That could very well be true, sir. But I have no recalls [sic] of that."
"When you visited at Thanksgiving and New Year's, did Jeff say anything about having some connection with a boxing team, working out with a boxing team?"
"I think there was some discussion of it, but—it's not ^strong memory of mine. In other words, I know that he was always involved in some kind of sport or other. He was also a trooper, a paratrooper. He was jumping. I went to see one of his jumps with Colette and the children and that kind of thing. You know, we spent time talking or watching him do things of this nature. He would play ball."
"Do you recall him saying anything about taking a trip with the boxing team?"
"There was some discussion. Yes, you're right. There was some discussion about that."
"Do you know where he was planning to go?"
"Oh, boy. Would Russia sound ridiculous?"
"No, it does not sound ridiculous."
"I just sort of had this mental flash, but it sounded like so far out."
"Did Colette have any comment to make on this proposed trip to Russia?"
"I think she was, again, like hoping that there wouldn't be a long absence. I must say probably there was some concern on her part because of course he had been absent a fair degree of the time because of his workload and his internship and so forth. But, by the same token, she understood that he had this, like, sort of desire to participate, and be, in a sense, an outstanding person. No matter what he did he was always trying to, you know, do a good job. That kind of thing."
"Did Colette have any reason to be jealous?"
"If she did she never mentioned it to me, sir. Okay? That's as fair as I can be with you. She might have been the type of woman that felt that way and would not discuss it with his parent. I do not know."
"Whether justified or not, did Colette think she had any reason to be jealous of Penny Wells?"
"Sir, you're asking me something that I have never heard discussed."
"Well, I'm going to ask you specifically: when Jeff was up there about September or October when Jay had this problem which caused him to be hospitalized, did Jeff have an occasion to look up Penny Wells, spend any time with her?"
"If he did, sir, it was without my knowledge."
"All right, now, on February 17 and in the days immediately thereafter, did you question your son in any way about any of the details of what had happened inside that apartment?"
"No, and may I emphasize that I was the mother of a young man whose wife and children were murdered and my concern was to give solace and to try and help him bear this agonizing burden. I did not question him."
"You stayed down there during that entire week?"
"Yes, sir, but my time was not always spent with Jeff. I had a few other things that I had to take care of."
"What things are you referring to?"
"Well, I got a telephone call from Mr. Hayes, and he said that Jay wanted to talk to me. And I spoke to Jay on the telephone and Jay sounded like he wasn't himself again, as though he might have been having one of those things that the doctors called a flashback.
"And he asked me, 'Mom, tell me what is happening?' And I told him and he sounded like he was a little disjointed, and I said to him, 'Where are you now?' And he said, I am with Billy.' And I asked Jay if he would be kind enough to let me speak to Billy, which he did, and I said to Billy, 'Jay sounds ill.' And Billy said, i am afraid to tell you, Mrs. MacDonald, that he really is not well again and I honestly don't know what to do.'
And I said to Billy, 'You know the hospital that he went to before and my only request is that if you feel he is not manageable, perhaps they will be able to help. Undoubtedly, it is a flashback, or to your knowledge, has he done anything stupid, like taking drugs again?'
"And Billy said, 'It is possible, I don't know. But he is getting messages out of the TV again, which is one of the symptoms of his trouble before.'
"And I said, 'Well, the messages he is getting today from the TV are very real, but I am sure that he can't keep them in perspective.' So I said, 'Billy, I can't be in two places at the same time and right now I really feel as though I cannot leave North Carolina.'
"So I asked Billy, 'Can you talk to him and see if he will voluntarily go with you back to the hospital?' And Billy said, 'Okay, I will try, Mrs. Mac' And I believe he called me back later that night to inform me that they had been successful in convincing Jay, not with ease, that he should return to the hospital.
"The next day, late that night after having visited Jeff, I got this message that I would have to call the hospital because something was wrong with Jay. So I called and they assured me—now this was probably close to midnight on the 18th, as I recall—that Jay was sound asleep. He had been tranquilized and he was fine.
"And I told the people on the phone that I was confused because the message indicated there had been some trouble. And they said, 'Well, Mrs. MacDonald, there was trouble earlier.' Apparently during the night he awoke and he did not know where he was, and he became very deranged and he put his fists through the window and said that he needed to get out and he had to get down to see what was going on. But they said they gave him heavy dosages of Thorazine, and it tended to quiet him down and now he was resting and in fact fast asleep."
"How long did Jay remain in the hospital? Isn't it true that he was at the funeral service?"
"Yes, that was because our family has this marvelous friend, Mr. Robert Stern, from New Hope, Pennsylvania, and when he heard Jay was in difficulty, he contacted a doctor in Bucks County and explained the situation and arranged for private, follow-up care, and for Jay to live with his family, because he had known Jay almost all his life, and the next day it was arranged for Jay to be released in his custody when it was decided that Jay was now manageable, and Mr. Stern took Jay from the hospital down into the Village to remove his clothing from the place where he was staying and took him back to Bucks County, to his own home.
"On the following day Mr. Stern felt it was imperative that Jay be present at the service, so that his presence would support the family and so there would be no conjecture as to why the brother was not there. So he flew down in his company plane, bringing Jay
, and then went back on the plane to Bob's home.
"The day after the internment in Long Island, I drove to Bucks County and spent probably a good part of that day talking with the psychiatrist who Mr. Stern had arranged for, trying to establish some background and then I drove back on down to Fort Bragg."
"Now, after Jeffrey was released from the hospital, did you and he have occasion to take a short trip together?"
"Yes, as I recall the wife of his commanding officer met me one day in the lobby of the place where I was staying and suggested that I take him to the seashore for a bit, just for a few days' recovery.
"I asked Jeff if he would like to go and he said yes, and we did go. And he just walked the seashore and we picked up shells and had breakfast. And I remember just driving around seeing the countryside and trying to restore. But on my honor I never probed. I could not ask questions. I felt that other people had."
"You didn't probe and he didn't volunteer, right?"
"That's correct."
"Now, after the charges were dropped," Woerheide said, "why didn't your son remain on the East Coast? Doesn't he have connections on the East Coast?"
"Yes sir, in a sense, but they are almost all painful. His father is gone, his grandmother is gone, his wife and children—primary— are gone. Even his house is gone. There is nothing there."
"But isn't it strange that he moved from one edge of the continent all the way out to the other?"
"At the time, you must remember, he was working very hard to get his life together, and he did work in New York for six months. And believe me, when you see what it is like to live in New York City, I don't think it is the ideal situation. It isn't a spot that either he or even Colette would have wanted to be. In other words, it was not their lifestyle.
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