by Don Wilding
The Next Generation
In 2009, the Matsos family sold ownership of Golden Rule Bar-B-Q to Jeff Miller. At the time, Miller owned hundreds of Lee’s and Mrs. Winner’s chicken restaurants. As part of the deal, the Matsos family had franchisee ownership of four Golden Rule Bar-B-Q locations, including the one in Irondale.
In 2012, Michael Matsos passed away. By the time he had reached the age of ninety-three, Matsos had served celebrities like Bob Hope and Charles Barkley at his numerous restaurants throughout the city and state. “He constantly amazed me with his business sense and leadership ability,” explained Derzis, who also described Matsos as an expert deal-maker.136
Despite Matsos’s death, Golden Rule Bar-B-Q continues to have a strong influence from the past. Every day, Booker and Derzis work at the Irondale location. Together, they have more than seventy years of experience in the barbecue industry. The Matsos family, led by Michael’s son Charles and daughter Michele, continue to own Golden Rule Bar-B-Q restaurants.137
BIG BOB GIBSON BAR-B-Q
The Origins of Big Bob Gibson
In the early 1920s, railroad worker Bob Gibson began a side business selling barbecue on the weekends from his backyard off Danville Road in Decatur. Gibson, who stood six feet four inches tall and weighed more than three hundred pounds, was popularly known by the nickname “Big Bob.” “He still was working for the railroad when he started barbecuing and kind of did that as a past-time in the backyard, but people seemed to like his food so well he decided to quit the railroad business,” explained Gibson’s grandson Don McLemore, who continues to help run the business.138
The Gibson family poses with the barbecue in Big Bob Gibson’s backyard at his home off Danville Road in Decatur. Chris Lilly.
Catherine McLemore, a daughter of Big Bob Gibson, poses with her son, Don, outside their home off Danville Road in Decatur, Alabama. Big Bob Gibson got his start cooking barbecue in the backyard of this home. Chris Lilly.
Big Bob Gibson poses with his barbecue and white bread at a park in Decatur. Chris Lilly.
After leaving his job on the railroad, Gibson cooperated with his brother-in-law, Sam Woodall, to open a restaurant on Moulton Road in Decatur called Gib-All’s. Woodall left the partnership to join his brother in business, and Gibson continued the operation under the now-famous name Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q. Gibson relocated his restaurant numerous times in the 1920s and 1930s. McLemore described the early restaurants as places where “you might stand up and place an order and might have a few chairs or stools or something.”139
As the business grew, it became a family endeavor. On the subject of family, McLemore recalled, “They all had an interest in the barbecue business. They all did go in the barbecue business, and that’s how they made their living—all of them.”140 Gibson’s restaurant rose from these humble origins to gain regional and national recognition due to his original white sauce recipe.
The Invention of White Sauce
Gibson crafted a vinegar-based white sauce to smother his smoked chickens. He split his chickens, seasoned them, roasted them over hickory smoke for three hours and then dunked them in the mayonnaise, vinegar and black pepper concoction. “I guess the thing he’s more well known for than anything in the barbecue world is his white sauce,” explained McLemore in reference to his grandfather.
Although the sauce was originally intended for chickens, customers now pour it on everything. “They will try it on pork, or some even try it on ribs,” explained McLemore. He added, “It’s very good on potato chips. A lot of kids do that. I’m not a kid, but I still do it once in a while myself.”141
Due to the success of the white sauce, it has become a staple of barbecue restaurants across the state. “What makes me feel good is when you go to some of the better-known restaurants in Alabama now, and you see that they have a bottle of white sauce,” said McLemore. His son-in-law, Chris Lilly, also recognizes the importance of white sauce to the state’s barbecue scene. “We’re most noted for our barbecue chicken with white sauce because it’s an original recipe,” boasted Lilly. “It’s cool to know that there’s a regional sauce that gets a lot of publicity, and it started here.”142
The Next Generations
In 1952, Big Bob relocated the restaurant to an existing building on Sixth Avenue in Decatur, but he also turned the business over to his daughter. Catherine McLemore offered to take over the day-to-day operations of the restaurant in exchange for half the business. Don characterized his grandfather as an outdoors person. “He liked to fish; he liked to hunt,” he explained. As part of the deal, therefore, Catherine let her father work as much or as little as he wanted. Don recalled, “He jumped right on it.” With a desire to fish more and relax, Big Bob accepted his daughter’s offer. Now, Big Bob could spend his time as he pleased.143
At the same time, they started selling their mouthwatering coconut cream, lemon icebox and chocolate cream pies. Maddie Johnson, who had started working at Big Bob Gibson’s Bar-B-Q in the 1940s, made the pies when Catherine added them to the menu. She continued to make pie for five decades. According to current owner Chris Lilly, “At Big Bob Gibson’s, the pie makers open the restaurant. They get here before the pit guys.” Recently, they have added pecan and peanut butter pies.
At Orange Lake near Gainesville, Florida, Big Bob Gibson shows off his catch. Chris Lilly.
In 1952, Big Bob Gibson opened this location of his restaurant on Highway 31 in Decatur. It remained in operation until 1987. At that time, the family constructed their own building on the adjacent property. Chris Lilly.
Inside the Highway 31 location of Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q in Decatur, a waitress serves a packed house. Chris Lilly.
On the far right, Maddie Johnson poses with the rest of the Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q staff. In 1947, Johnson started working for Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q and remained employed there for many decades. Chris Lilly.
After Gibson’s death in 1972, his five grandchildren, including Don, and their spouses took over the business. Under new ownership, Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q relocated one more time and opened a second location. In 1987, they built a larger restaurant on Sixth Avenue because their previous landlords refused to allow them to remodel and expand the existing structure. In 1992, they opened a restaurant on Danville Road. These two locations remain open for business.
They also modernized the facilities. Originally, Big Bob smoked the meat, which he purchased from local farmers, in an “old-fashioned concrete block pit.” His family has since modernized their methods for the sake of commercial feasibility and safety, but Don insisted, “we come as close as we can” to cooking meat in that traditional manner. “We still have the old-fashioned brick pits—not concrete blocks but brick and firebrick. We have a flat grate and we have a big fire up in the front of the pit, and we cook with indirect heat and smoke.”144
Before the restaurant opens, Diane Wilhite and D make pies every day for the large crowds who pack Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q. Author’s collection.
Like the other pie makers at Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q, Joanne Gunner arrives to work before anyone else to make fresh pies for the restaurant. Author’s collection.
Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q offers numerous types of pie, including this coconut cream pie. Chris Lilly.
Before Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q opens, only the cooks and pie makers have arrived at the restaurant. Author’s collection.
After the lunch crowd, Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q sits quiet before the evening rush hits. Author’s collection.
Chris Lilly, of Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q, surveys the pit room during a quiet part of the day. Author’s collection.
When Gibson opened his first restaurant, he served pork shoulders, chickens, coleslaw and potato chips, but the menu has continued to expand over the last few decades. In the late 1980s, the menu has expanded to meats like beef brisket and turkey, ribs and more modern dishes like barbecue-stuffed potatoes and barbecue-topped salads, served to an increasingly national and transient audience. “We were t
he first barbecue restaurant in Alabama, to my knowledge, that started selling the barbecue potato and, at the time, they were cheap to buy because we used the real big potatoes,” explained McLemore. These baked potatoes, stuffed with butter, sour cream, chives, bacon, cheese and a choice of barbecued chicken, turkey, pulled pork or beef brisket, soon became a hit throughout the state. McLemore boasted, “Now you can’t hardly go to a restaurant in Alabama and not get a barbecue potato.”145
They cook pork shoulders and beef brisket all night long and carve each sandwich and plate to order. They cook whole pork shoulders, which includes the picnic and the pork butt, for seventeen hours overnight. Big Bob only rubbed his pork shoulders with salt, but they now use a blended dry rub. According to Lilly, “We carve to order, one shoulder at a time.” They avoid chopping it ahead of time in order to retain the juices. “If you chop it ahead of time and try to hold it, you need to add a lot of sauces to keep it moist,” said Lilly, who now helps run the restaurant.146
Mike Wilson, who founded the Saw’s family of restaurants, supervises the staff and tastes the product at his Avondale location, Saw’s Soul Kitchen. Author’s collection.
At Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q, a pulled pork sandwich comes topped with vinegar-based coleslaw. Chris Lilly.
The cooks at Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q pull the pork shoulders to order to maintain moisture. Chris Lilly.
Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q serves turkey platters with two sides and a pickle. Like all their dishes, it does not come with sauce because they want to leave that option to the customer. Chris Lilly.
Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q serves its turkey on a salad for the healthconscious customer. Chris Lilly.
This Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q combination platter features pulled pork and smoked chicken, which has been drizzled with white sauce. The sauce, which Big Bob Gibson invented, consists of mayonnaise, vinegar and black pepper. Ken Hess.
In addition to their famous smoked chicken and white sauce, Big Bob Gibson offers pork ribs, among other items. Ken Hess.
At Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q, customers can order beef brisket as well as the pork and chicken that typically feature on the menus of Alabama barbecue restaurants. Ken Hess.
Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q makes pie every single day, including this chocolate cream pie. Chris Lilly.
Every morning, the pie makers open Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q to make fresh pie for the day. Chris Lilly.
Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q offers customers many choices, including this BarBQ Pork Sandwich. Elaine Lyda.
For six decades, Bob, Maxine and Van Sykes have been working in the restaurant industry. Elaine Lyda.
Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q slow cooks pork butts over an open pit. Elaine Lyda.
Among many sides, Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q offers onion rings. Elaine Lyda.
In addition to pork sandwiches, Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q offers rib sandwiches. Elaine Lyda.
John “Big Daddy” Bishop proudly serves his famous ribs. For a long time, he only served them with white bread. Dreamland Bar-B-Que.
At Demetri’s BBQ, the pork sandwich is the bestseller. Sam Nakos.
Unlike barbecue restaurants in the northern part of the state, Demetri’s BBQ serves its chicken with red, tomato-based sauce. Sam Nakos.
To complement a diverse menu, Demetri’s BBQ has many sides, including green beans, baked beans and fried okra. Sam Nakos.
At Golden Rule Bar-B-Q in Irondale, pork slowly cooks over an open pit. Author’s collection.
Originally, Dreamland Bar-B-Que only sold ribs and white bread. Now, they have pulled pork, sausages and more. Dreamland Bar-B-Que.
When John “Big Daddy” Bishop opened the restaurant, he did not have pork sandwiches or side items. As the restaurant expanded, they needed more options to reach a wider audience. Dreamland Bar-B-Que.
In 2006, Dreamland Bar-B-Que ran a campaign to posthumously elect John “Big Daddy” Bishop as governor. He ran on the platform of the Dinner Party. Long before barbecue dominated the restaurant scene, Alabamians used barbecue to practice their politics. Today, barbecue remains fundamental to politics. Before the 2016 presidential election, candidate John Kasich visited Dreamland Bar-B-Que in Birmingham. Dreamland Bar-B-Que.
Dreamland Bar-B-Que serves world-famous ribs with their famous sauce. Dreamland Bar-B-Que.
At Moe’s Original BBQ, they do more than barbecue. They serve catfish and shrimp po’ boys, as well. Mike Fernandez.
Moe’s Original BBQ serves their chickens and turkeys with white sauce. Mike Fernandez.
Moe’s founders Ben Gilbert, Mike Fernandez and Jeff Kennedy all come from Alabama, but they started their first restaurant in Vail, Colorado. Mike Fernandez.
The smoked chicken sandwich comes topped with coleslaw. Mike Fernandez.
At Moe’s Original BBQ, the rib platter comes with sides and a drink. Mike Fernandez.
The smoked wings platter comes with white sauce and side items. Mike Fernandez.
Libby Fernandez developed the coleslaw recipe that tops this turkey sandwich. Mike Fernandez.
In recent years, Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q has expanded its dessert menu to include cakes. Elaine Lyda.
Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q bottles and sells its original sauce. Many of Alabama’s barbecue restaurants aspire to sell their own sauce across the state and the country. Elaine Lyda.
In Bessemer, Van Sykes tends the pit at Bob Sykes Bar-B-Q. Elaine Lyda.
In the morning, they start cooking chicken, ribs and turkey. They procure all of their American-raised meat from purveyors in Birmingham, Huntsville and just across the border in Tennessee. “I think you are doing yourself a great disservice if you limit yourself to one meat supplier,” explained Lilly. Before ordering, he surveys the meat for price, color and marbelization to make the best choice.
Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q Ribs
Cooking Method: indirect heat
Suggested Wood: hickory
Cook time: 4 hours
2 slabs St. Louis cut pork spare ribs
Dry Rub
2 tablespoons brown sugar
1 tablespoon paprika
1½ teaspoons kosher salt
1 teaspoon black pepper
½ teaspoon garlic salt
½ teaspoon onion salt
¼ teaspoon celery salt
½ teaspoon red pepper
½ teaspoon ground cumin
1 bottle Big Bob Gibson Championship Red Sauce
Remove the membrane from the back of the rib. In a small bowl, combine the dry rub ingredients and mix well. Apply generously to the front and back of ribs, patting gently to ensure the rub adheres.
Build a fire (wood or combination of charcoal and wood) for indirect cooking by situating the coals on only one side of the grill, leaving the other side void. Preheat charcoal cooker to 250 degrees Fahrenheit. Place the ribs on the grill meat side up and cook with indirect heat for 3 hours 45 minutes or until the ribs are tender.
Remove ribs from cooker and paint with Big Bob Gibson Championship Red Sauce. Put the ribs back on the cooker over indirect heat and cook until the sauce caramelizes, 10 to 15 minutes. Remove the ribs from the grill and let them rest for 10 minutes before serving.
Like other Alabama barbecue restaurants, Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q uses hickory wood to build its fires. According to Lilly, “The most important aspect of wood is how long it’s seasoned. It’s more important than the variety of wood. When you get a nice seasoned wood, you get a mellow smoke and a great smoky flavor.” The seasoning process consists of drying the wood to the desired moisture content. At Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q, they use hickory wood that has been seasoned for four to six months.147
Over the years, Big Bob Gibson Bar-B-Q has left an impression on more than just the Alabama barbecue scene. Recently, it has attained international fame because of the success of Chris Lilly at international barbecue cook-offs.
Chris Lilly Joins the Family Business
Born in 1968 in Florence, Chris Lilly learned to appreciate food, especially barbecue, from his parents, but he
never envisioned becoming the owner of a barbecue restaurant and world champion pit master. “My family sat down for dinner every night and ate as a family. I had a good hot meal every night and enjoyed food,” recalled Chris.148
Like most Alabamians, Chris fondly remembers his father, Owen Lilly Jr., cooking barbecue in the backyard. Whenever his father cooked outside, he wanted to help. As a child, Chris experimented with marinades and seasonings. “Growing up, cooking is something I always liked to do, but I never thought it would turn into a profession.” He admitted, “I never dreamed I would be in the barbecue business.”149
In addition to backyard cooking, Owen took his large family to some of Alabama’s famous barbecue restaurants. “My dad loved barbecue. I still remember going around to the barbecue restaurants with the old pit masters shoveling coals under the pit,” Chris recalled. Growing up in Florence, Chris enjoyed pork sandwiches at locally famous Bunyan’s Bar-B-Que, located on West College Street not far from McFarland Park on the Tennessee River, and Dick Howell’s Barbeque Pit, which remains in the same cinderblock restaurant that Chris’s father helped build.150