I wish he would do more stuff. He makes films so rarely and he’s so good at it.
I do, too. He really recognizes the work that is being done for him and is a very complimentary guy.
One of the things that you mentioned to me off tape was that you are an art collector and dealer. Do you find that your background in the art business affects the way you look at the Special FX that you do for horror films?
I think so, yes.
I would think that it would.
It actually does. There were very few living artists that we handled or handle now for a reason, but when we did, it was the same thing. You have to have the eye and the ability to [decide] who can do what the best and help conceive and conceptualize the whole thing. It’s weird that you should say that because it hit me that it’s the same exact thing in these monster movies. I’m on this movie Bat Out of Hell for HBO and it just hits me naturally that Steve Johnson should do this specific character, Grail, and that KNB should handle the other characters (bounty hunters from Hell) along with the gore, burn make-ups, and such. Hell, there is even a bit I would like Screaming Mad George to do as well as a fella Roy Knyrim whom I met ten years ago through Herschell Gordon Lewis. Knyrim heads a make-up effects shop out here called State of the Art Effects. However, to be honest, I really think this project won’t be made. This sort of thing happens a lot, and you can really smell ‘em out – ‘the shitters’ – and this has shitter written all over it, but we’ll see…
Grail suits Steve’s sensibilities.
Exactly. It’s really just a creative form of producing.
I want to ask you about Lucio Fulci. I know you knew him pretty well. What can you tell me about your relationship with him?
He’s a god. He was everything I expected and more. I knew there was no excuse not to go up there [and meet with him]. Nothing could have interfered with that, nothing on earth including that storm. [There was the biggest blizzard in New York history hitting the city at the time of the Fangoria convention where this meeting took place -ed] I made it up there. When I first saw him, he knew who I was because I’d tried to have him play the devil in that Revolting Cocks video. It just could not work out. Loris Curci, his interpreter, knew to introduce us. I’d just gotten off the stage because I’d premiered my new Motorhead video and then went into the audience and then I saw him. Man. I couldn’t believe it. It was him, and yet, at the same time, I was a little shocked at how old he looked and that he was having to be helped to walk. All of that completely changed when he took the stage and truly saw the turnout of people who came to that event. I don’t think that, honestly, in the circumstances that people had to fight to get there, someone like Mick Jagger would have gotten that type of turnout. I’m serious. The guy had the charisma and the power of a great dictator. He just came to life and completely consumed the audience. It was magnificent. Shortly after that, I was introduced to him and hugged. It was totally wondrous. I went up to his room, shot the shit, and then we were snowed in. It was snowing horribly, but it was official now that no one was going anywhere. All the airports soon closed. I remembered that night; he took off his shoe and his left foot looked like something out of Richard Johnson’s lab. His left foot was damn near gangrenous. It had been crushed while shooting a commercial between a boat and a dock. I helped him redress it and it was a living testament to this man’s will and devotion to horror, his fans, and the craft. Nothing would hold him back. He must have been in incredible pain. Anyway, we got it all taken care of, then sat him down and we talked. The next day, I went up there and he was trying to get back to Rome. He was talking to this fellow Mr. Colombo about The Wax Mask and he was so pissed that he couldn’t fly or find any way out because, again, he was totally dedicated. He wanted to get back there and get to work. When it was obvious that it wasn’t going to happen, I went out and somehow bought a VCR… somehow… two junkies were selling a VCR on 42nd Street and I bought it, hooked it up in his room, and rented some movies and showed him my tapes and videos. He gave me the biggest compliment of all, he watched them like three times in a row and said, ‘You have the eye.’ I said, ‘My god, thank you.’ It’s funny, being a Texan wop, we’re still speaking with our hands very, very loudly and Gabriella Leone (who was there with me) who was from North Hollywood and she’s thinking we’re fighting. She doesn’t understand that’s how we’re communicating, in this loud, fucking tone. It was utterly beautiful. It was also shocking to me how this guy knew all of the bands. He knew Lemmy of Motorhead. He knew mainstream movies. The guy was completely, prolifically intelligent. That night was very, very interesting. Michael Weldon (Psychotronic Video Guide) was snowed in and, as you know, I have a long relationship with the Psychotronic. Weldon’s wife, Mia, is Korean and she knew of a Korean restaurant that was actually open and wasn’t that far away. We were all getting stir crazy and decided to go for it. I talked Fulci into going. It was hilarious because it was still snowing and Tony Timpone and I literally carried Fulci through the snow. The first time, I had him on my back to carry him to the cab. When there wasn’t a cab, we carried him from the restaurant back to the Pennsylvania Hotel. We just carried him on either side and it was like one of those interesting evenings. The dinner was just fabulous the way he would carry on and his rantings were monumental. It was just cool as hell. I’ll never forget it as long as I live. The next day… I don’t know if you remember, but during those days it was always rumored that Fulci was a heroin shooter. A lot of those guys are rumored to be that way, because, of course, they are. [laughs] I remember seeing the syringes in his bathroom and I’m thinking, ‘Aaw, shit. What the fuck is going on here?’ I figured the pain he was in and whatever, I don’t blame him. He came storming into the bathroom, grabbed the very syringes I was looking at and he shouted, ‘No good! No good!’ I said, ‘What can I do, Lucio?’ thinking he was asking for some smack or something. [laughs] He then explained that all of the needles were uselessly blunt and he didn’t have anymore and he had to have them for his life. I didn’t realize, nor did anyone else, he was a diabetic. So, this next day was very late in the evening and I didn’t know what to do. He gave me some Rome card that permitted him to get syringes, which I knew wouldn’t work in that fucking state. It’s ironic, if I was in conservative Fort Worth, I could get some, but in New York, it’s a big deal. I didn’t realize how big of a deal it was. It was actually impossible. Again, the whole city was shut down, but a few pharmacies were open. It was hopeless. Then, when I was literally fucking freezing, I walk into this one and went into the back. I asked this black pharmacist if he could spare any syringes and I recognized immediately that wonderful black, southern accent identifying it immediately with Texas. I said, ‘Man, where are you from?’ He said, ‘Fort Worth.’ And I said, ‘So am I. God damn it! Do you remember seeing that movie Zombie at the Ridgeley?’ I couldn’t believe it. At first he thought I was talking about Dawn of the Dead. I said, ‘No man, that one where that girl’s eye was pulled right into the splinter.’ He said, ‘Yeah, man! I remember that!’ I said, ‘Under the guise of Texas, you’ve got to help the director who gave us that beautiful image.’ I explained the whole thing to him and he slipped five syringes out risking his position.
That’s a great story.
Well, us Texans all band together stronger than any race, religion, or creed not to mention most of us love horror and firearms. So, I went back there and gave him the syringes. He just couldn’t believe it. He’d been sort of abandoned since his assistant or whatever had been snowed in on some other end of town. I think that’s the nice way to put it. I just stayed with him the whole time, brought him new socks and shit. He got through it, then invited me to work on The Wax Mask and wanted me to be in it. I said to him, ‘Hey man, it would be no problem for me to bring my own head, KNB manufactured.’ He was very thrilled and delighted. It was very, very emotional. A total gentleman and a great man. So, he left and you know the rest. I just couldn’t believe it when I heard [about him dying], man.
It was so sad. I want to ask you another question. It has to do with some things I’d heard about the way he was pulled off of The Wax Mask.
He was never pulled off. I know that there are rumors floating around, but you have to remember that there are really high temperatures with Italians. I am one, so I can say that the stereotype is true. I know Argento and those guys are all competitors. They’re all loud and then, when they’re in person, they all love each other, but if you’re leading up to the one that I think you might be, I don’t believe it. It’s sad that I heard that Fulci is buried in a pauper’s cemetery, but, at the same, time, that’s Fulci, you know? He was one of those guys who was dedicated to his art first and foremost. ‘Who cares about how I’m killing myself for my art.’ That’s the way the people who are remembered are.
Let me ask you about your involvement with the upcoming release of Cat in the Brain.
Well, I talked with Fulci about that one when I was up there at length. I had just got one of those eighth generation copies. I was very interested in it because he’s the star and it’d never been released here. We were speaking and mentioned some of the similarities between that and Wes Craven’s New Nightmare. I really loved the film for several reasons. It’s made for nothing. It’s shot on 16mm. I defy anybody that mocks it to do anything better. It’s under a hundred thousand dollars. But, I really like it because it… well… because it’s the most violent fucking movie ever made. [laughs] But also because it has all these healthy meanings, just allegorical things to it that point out that psychiatry is fucked up. You should never go to something like that because it is. He confirmed with me that, yes, that’s what he was mocking. Another good thing about it was how it points out how could any of this cinematic art or film be responsible for spawning real life violence which is the underlying text to all of that. It is the psychiatrist who is hypnotized and brainwashed him into hallucinating that everything he’s doing on film is real in an effort to get rid of this horror director who is demoralizing our society. It’s like I’ve always said since I was a kid when I see the ignorance of the Tipper Gores and Al Gores and the Clintons that have really inflicted the major censorship of this country, ‘Show me the films that Marquis DeSade, Caligula, Tiberius, Joseph Mengele, or even Adolph watched before they committed the most heinous crimes against humanity.’ I remember when I said that to Fulci, he applauded. It’s from within and has nothing to do with film. And on that note, anyone who doesn’t think that it’s that legislation that has caused the major censorship in this country, just look who was in control when you could drive to a fucking general cinema and see the X rated cut of Andy Warhol’s Dracula or Frankenstein. Do you remember Jerry Gross opening up Zombie like Face/Off is opening up today? It’s not the fat cats. They figure if it makes money, it’s ok. It’s the armchair judging ass holes. I think it’s all summed up in the Nightline debate between Herschell Gordon Lewis and Tipper Gore. Just remember that the head of the M.P.A.A. is Jack Valenti who is an icon of Democrats.
That guy is so scary.
He was Bill Clinton’s third biggest contributor, but when Ronnie Reagan was in, baby, everything from Day of the Dead to Doctor Butcher M.D. (Medical Deviate) was at United Artists, AMC, and all the other major venues. Outstanding!
Century Almaden in my hometown. That was the stuff.
It’s just one of those ironies that I would like to see in print so we don’t make this mistake again. MTV got Bill Clinton in with this ‘Vote No for Censorship. Vote for Bill Clinton.’ Well, why the fuck didn’t any of my videos play after that?
So, you’re packaging Cat in the Brain for laserdisc.
Yeah. Bob Murawski is an old friend and a partner on this issue. Murawski is the one who went to Rome with Sage Stallone… You know, Sage was going to star in a key role in Wax Mask and Murawski was set to be the editor. Bob has earned his silver star three-fold for his most admirable work in fully restoring these films – which has been a most tedious task for him, but they look fucking excellent!
Now they make up Grindhouse Releasing?
Yes. Sage is the one who found Fulci in Rome while shooting Daylight. I think Fulci was just amazed that the son of this mega-star was totally in love with him. Sage really paved the way into these deals. Sage’s chief targets were The Beyond, Gates of Hell, and, when he mentioned to me Cat in the Brain and that he wasn’t going to get it. I was thinking, ‘God damn, that’s the one I want.’ Then, Bob, who was working with Sage said about acquiring the rights, ‘All right, let’s do it.’ I said, ‘Fuckin’ A, man.’ It’s never been released. It kind of has a certain charm.
Do you have anything to do with some of the other things they’re doing like The Beyond or Cannibal Ferox?
Only in helping out, from giving them photographs I took of Fulci, little odds and ends like posters, the keychain that came out when [The Beyond] was Seven Doors of Death, to getting the company logo made. They had a great idea of doing the old Previews of Coming Attractions logo from the seventies where it comes in from six different sides and it says ‘Grindhouse Releasing’ rather than ‘Previews of Coming Attractions.’ Of course, it’s a tag from Trailers From the Crypt that I had digitally scanned in at Digital Magic, who was one of the key houses on Wishmaster.
I also hear that you’re doing the liner notes for this Fulci music CD being released by Blackest Heart Media and Graveside Entertainment.
Right. Well, one of the divine who was actually in attendance at the Fulci New York event was Shawn Smith and I didn’t know Shawn Smith from Adam, but I shortly did after he was cheering at my Motorhead video, ‘Sacrifice,’ that was premiered there. I remember being on stage thinking, ‘Who the fuck is this?’ Someone who really got what I did. Then, I sat a couple of seats down from him when Fulci entered and, again, the guy was goin’ off like he was at a fucking Who concert. I thought, ‘This guy looks too young to love and care for this stuff, but he truly does.’ So, I knew I had to meet him. About a fifth of Jack Daniels later, we made a pretty good friendship. He’s a good guy. Top shelf.
Yeah, he is a good guy. I did an intro for The Smuggler for the disc, and when I walked into his house, the first thing I saw was this huge framed subway poster for The Beyond and I thought. ‘This guy’s ok.’
The room I’m standing in right now, you’d really appreciate. I got the Blind Dead on either side of the TV, that exo-skeleton from Return 3 is hanging from the ceiling, the actual ‘The End’ title card to Horror of the Blood Monsters… There’s four original Clive Barker paintings. The twenty-by-sixty [poster] to She Freak. On and on, my friend… a blitzkrieg of depravity.
I was reading something on the Internet recently where someone had said, ‘The movie Scream saved the horror genre from itself.’ I’d like to get your comments on that.
Wes and I are friends and I’m a little bit more appreciative of his career when he was doing films like The Hills Have Eyes…
Last House on the Left.
Yeah. Now, Scream is a movie that, in the end, seems to have a tone that blames horror films for violence, not exactly the tone of a picture like Cat in the Brain which has its balls fully attached. Scream… I don’t know, man. They say you can’t argue with success, but yet, I don’t know why Terror Train didn’t make a hundred million dollars. [laughs] It’s just an early to mid-80’s body count picture that seems to pick on the genre. Now, I should not ever speak harshly against Scream because it’s not my cup of tea, but thank god for Scream. Do you know why? It fucking made the horror genre top notch again. I potentially made a very, very big sale with Cat in the Brain in the legitimate market because of Scream making the horror genre hot as hell. Horror films have always made money since Thomas Edison’s Frankenstein in 1910. But right now, they are incredibly hot and that’s thanks to Scream. So, on that level, it’s tremendous. Ironically, Scream helped out Cat in the Brain so how can I complain? Further, it will help other horror projects get off the ground like, hopefully, my own and others. Perhaps
it will even aid genre directors I really respect like Buddy Giovinazzo [Combat Shock] get a new film in the works.
Carpe Noctem Interviews - Volume 2 Page 13