by Fred Rosen
Mary paused, looked down, then looked up at Rainey and said earnestly, “I didn’t believe that they had actually done this even though my common sense should have told me better, ’cause, you know, we went to get rid of a gun.” You dumb ass, she thought. And when she got home, she told her husband John what had happened.
Rainey wanted to know what Joe had told her about the shooting.
“Joe said that it was him and Jim went in there and Joe was rifling through the bitch’s purse.”
“The bitch,” meaning Aaron’s girlfriend, Carrie. Mary continued: “And Aaron turned his head like he was waking up or something and Jim never hesitated. He just capped his ass right in the head.”
In order to catch someone in a lie, go over their story again. And that’s what Rainey did.
“Okay. So, you get back, you drop Joe off at the house. You tell your husband John that these guys say they just capped Aaron. Then what happens?”
“My husband says, ‘No they didn’t. They’re just telling you that.’ And I said, ‘Well, why did they tell me that?’ And he says, ‘Well, they think they’re big and bad. And they’re trying to impress Beau and they’re trying to impress you!’ I said, ‘You’re right.’ It sounded reasonable to me. And John and I went to bed. And the next thing I know, John’s coming in and telling me, ‘There’s three cops out here.’”
“This is when Detective Raynor came to question you?” Rainey asked.
“Yes,” Mary replied. “And then you guys told me that Aaron had been shot. I thought somebody else did it, and the kids were capitalizing on it, trying to take the, uh, you know …”
“Credit for it?” Rainey said, finishing the sentence.
“Credit for it,” Mary agreed.
“So when we showed up at the house, and we let you know this is happening and we’re asking for information—”
“I thought Beau did it. I really did.”
“And we told you, I think at that time, that we had already checked and Beau was in custody at the time of the murder.”
Mary nodded.
“So what’s your reason for not having told us the whole story right then and there, Mary?”
“Number one, I didn’t believe they were capable of that. Number two, I was afraid for my safety, and my son’s safety. I figured if these kids could murder, they could do me and they could do Beau.”
“Okay. So going back even before that when you gave Crazy Joe a ride to the river ’cause he asks you to do that so he can get rid of the gun. From a lot of people’s perspective that would suggest that there really is some truth here to what these guys are claiming. That they had just done Aaron. Why is it that you didn’t attach more weight to what they were saying?”
Or, put another way, why was Mary such a moron that she refused to believe she was handling the murder weapon in a capital murder case?
“I just didn’t believe them,” Mary answered. “I just couldn’t conceive of them doing that. I guess part of me was kinda in shock. Like, ‘Damn!’ You know? And then trying to weed out the wheat from the chaff.”
But what really took her aback was that neither Elstad nor Brown looked shaken. They had just killed a man and they looked like they were out for a midnight walk. Both cops knew that such behavior was consistent with psychopaths, a breed of human apart, who felt no guilt for their crimes.
“Did you see any blood on anybody?” Rainey wondered.
“There was no blood.”
“Did you make a point of looking for it?” Rainey pressed, leaning forward and touching Mary’s arm, trying to crowd her into the corner he had placed her in.
“Yeah. And riding in the truck, I couldn’t smell the gun,” Mary smoothly answered, leaning forward and meeting Rainey’s steely gaze. “And I’m thinking, ‘They’re bullshitting me.’”
Raynor had a question.
“When you were in the car, Mary, and going to the river …”
“Yes?”
“… where did Joe carry the gun?”
“I’m not sure, but I think it was in the front of his pants.”
Rainey, though, wanted to pin down the make of the murder weapon.
“Describe the gun for us as best you can.”
“Thirty-eight wheel gun,” said Mary in clipped tones. “Had wooden handles, wooden-like stock and stock grip.”
She talks like a gangster and knows guns like one, Rainey thought.
“And the rest of it was blue steel,” Mary added. “Maybe a three-and-a-half, four-inch barrel. Top length.”
“Any idea what brand the gun was?” Rainey persisted.
“Maybe Smith and Wesson.”
“A Smith and Wesson or something else?”
“Maybe a Ruger. They told me it was a thirty-eight. The week before, I knew they had a thirty-eight and, I just believed it to be the same gun.”
“Did this look like the same gun they had the week before?” Raynor interjected.
Mary said that it did indeed, that Joe Brown had taken custody of the gun the week before and Joe Brown showed her the gun when the boys came to her house after the murder. As for getting rid of it, “That happened after we were in the car and we were going down River Road. Joe said, ‘I’m gonna throw this gun in the river.’”
“When you got down by the bridge, did Joe tell you where to stop?”
Rainey was trying to see if Mary had any complicity in dumping the murder weapon.
“Joe directed me where to go,” she answered smoothly.
“Or was there conversation between the two of you?”
“Joe directed me where to go down River Avenue ’cause I wasn’t familiar with that road. But, I knew it had to go down in there somewhere ’cause I drive over the Beltline and see people with their boats. And, I see the sheep on the other side going right down to the river. And he told me to pull in, as we went under the underpass he said, told me where to stop. I guess you call it the boat ramp side. And, I stopped right there on the road, on the corner. And I said, ‘Go do it.’ And he jumped out and ran down to the river. He was gone maybe a minute, maybe two, then he came back up and got in the truck and said, ‘It’s gone.’”
“So, whose idea was it to get rid of the gun?” Rainey persisted.
“Joe’s.”
“Did he say why he needed to do that?”
“Well, not in so many words, but it was implied, I think, because they told me that they had just shot Aaron.”
“So, your understanding was just that he’s getting rid of the gun because it’s evidence that could be used against him?”
“Yeah.”
“Okay. So when, when Crazy Joe comes back up from the river, does he have any water on him at all? Or, does it look like he’s waded or anything?”
“Nope.”
Rainey was trying to establish whether Brown threw the weapon out in the river, which could be pretty far out depending upon the strength of his arm. Otherwise, if he walked in, he could only go as far as he could stand. In any case, the cop knew that a search would be launched for the murder weapon and wanted to pin down where it was in the river.
“And, that’s another thing,” Mary continued. “I wasn’t even sure that he had gotten rid of it. I thought maybe he was lying.”
“Why would you think that he didn’t get rid of the gun?”
“’Cause I had my window open, and I didn’t hear a splash.”
“So you just weren’t convinced he’d done it, huh?”
Mary nodded.
“Please speak up for the tape.”
“No.”
“No, what?”
Mary sighed.
“I just wasn’t convinced that Joe had dumped the gun.”
Rainey made some notes on his yellow foolscap pad, then looked up.
“So when Jim and Crazy Joe come to your house, and tell you that they’ve just capped Aaron, who’s doing the talking?”
“Both. But, not out of fear or excitement. They were both talking real calm.
”
Just like a psychopath, Rainey thought.
“And they said, ‘We just capped his ass.’ I said, ‘Who did?’ And Jim said, ‘I did.’”
“And then, at that point Jim leaves?”
“Uh huh. And Joe runs out with him, then Joe comes back and I said, ‘I’ll take you home.’”
“Was there any conversation at that time regarding how exactly the murder occurred?”
“No. No.”
“So the information about Crazy Joe going through the purse, did that come out in a later conversation?”
“Yeah.”
“When was that conversation?” Raynor wondered.
“I think that one came out in the truck with Joe. He said that he was going through the bitch’s purse, and Aaron turned his head and Jim never hesitated. He went, ‘Pooooh!’”
“How’d they get in the room?” Rainey continued.
“They went through the garage door.”
“They said that or one of them said that?”
“Joe said that.”
And motive? While the law didn’t require it, Rainey knew that motive helped to convict.
“Did you ask Joe why they killed Aaron that night?”
“No, ’cause I didn’t think they did it. I couldn’t believe it.”
Mary sounded extremely convincing.
“So, what was your understanding from either Jim or Joe about who was actually at Aaron’s place when the killing took place?”
That was crucial. With both boys on the scene, it would be two murder charges instead of one.
“My understanding from Joe Brown was that Joe Brown was there and Jim Elstad.”
“So, do you know how they got to and from Aaron’s house?”
Translation: Was there a getaway car with a driver we can also charge?
“On foot. I just concluded that they did it on foot.”
“What else can you remember Joe told you during the car ride?”
“He said something about if Jim gets caught, he’ll say he did it.”
“That he would take responsibility for killing Aaron?”
“Right. And I said something about, ‘Well, do you really think they’re gonna catch Jim?’ And he said, ‘Nah.’ And that also led me to believe that nothing had actually happened.”
“Did Joe indicate to you that he knew that when he went to Aaron’s place that night that Aaron was gonna die?”
“No.”
“So, is it possible from what they told you then, that when they went there, it wasn’t specifically with the plan of killing him? But that it just happened while they were there?”
In which case, it wouldn’t be premeditated and the death penalty would be off the table.
Mary looked perplexed. She shook her head. “I don’t know. I don’t have those answers. They didn’t tell me. And I wasn’t there.”
Rainey leaned in toward Mary and without thinking, she sat back in her chair.
“Was there any information from these guys or anybody else for that matter, that anything was taken from Aaron’s room?”
“No.”
“Then what was Crazy Joe going through her purse for?”
“Looking for her wallet.”
“And what was he gonna do with that?”
“Take the money!” Mary exclaimed, not bothering to hide the impatience.
“Is that what you know or are you guessing?”
“That’s just what I figured.”
“Mary, since then, since that morning, have you talked to any of these people?” Raynor interjected.
“I’ve talked to everybody since then, except Wayde Hudson,” she answered quickly.
She was glad Raynor, whom she trusted, had begun to question her. She felt that Rainey was just trying to trap her into some sort of admission.
“You’ve talked to Jim?”
She nodded.
“I talked to Jim on the phone on Monday while he was at the hospital and his sister was in labor.”
Jim Elstad’s sister Angel had been pregnant and had just given birth to a healthy baby boy. Angel had stopped by that night. She recalled that the girl had been too pregnant to get out of the car.
“Did you talk about the incident?” Raynor continued, substituting the less emotional word “incident” for “murder.”
“No. He called up and told me that Aaron Iturra had been shot. And I went, ‘So?’”
Gee, she’s being real emotional about this, Rainey thought.
“See, this is all part of what’s mind-blowing to me,” Mary continued. “He said that the police had been there and put stuff on his hands, and there was nothing wrong with his hands. And then we talked about Angel. And at that point, when he told me nothing came up on his hands, I kind of thought, ‘Well, he didn’t do it.’ ’Cause what I know about it is what I got off the TV, and that stuff changes colors right away. You know? So, this was part of me not believing he did it.”
“How about Joe Brown? Have you talked to him since then?”
“I’ve talked to Joe every day. And, Joe just keeps calling me and telling me the cops are jammin’ him. And I said, ‘If you didn’t do anything, you have nothing to be guilty of.’ He said, ‘Yeah, you’re right.’ And then, it was kinda like, yesterday when Angel told me that Jim did it and that I needed to tell the police, I knew then that they did it for sure.”
“Well, let’s talk about that conversation with Angel then,” said Rainey, leaning back in his seat. “When did that occur? Did she call you or …”
“No, she came by on her way home from the hospital with Christopher, her baby.”
“Okay. So, the baby and Angel are there. You’re there. Is anybody else present during this conversation?”
“No.”
“And what does Angel tell you?”
“Angel walks back up under the carport and I look her right in the eye and I go, ‘These guys didn’t do this.’ And she said, ‘Jim did it.’ And that floored me. I was still trying to believe they hadn’t done it until Angel looked me in the eye and said, ‘Jim did it. That’s why you need to tell the police we were here Sunday night visiting until about eleven thirty.’”
In other words, Rainey thought, “Gang Mom” was supposed to provide Elstad and Brown with an alibi. They were visiting her instead of murdering Aaron.
“She was supposed to call me later in the afternoon, and I was supposed to go over and see the baby. And I assume that that was to talk to her about what had happened. And then, I had the phone call from you asking me what time they were here till. And I said, ‘Eleven thirty. Eleven fifteen or eleven thirty.’ And, I hung up and I said, ‘No. I can’t continue to do this.’”
Nope, Mary was a good citizen. She wouldn’t lie for one of her kids. But it was okay for Aaron to lie to protect Beau. She failed to see the irony.
Rainey said, “So when I call you later, after Angel has just spoken with you, the information that you gave me about them visiting the house earlier in the evening on that Sunday …”
“Was incorrect.”
“And that lie was based on what Angel had asked you to do.”
Mary nodded.
“Why would she ask you to do that as opposed to somebody else?”
“Well, because she was trying to make sure I said the same thing so there would be no questions.”
“She was trying to line up her story, then?”
Mary nodded.
“So you and Angel haven’t had any further conversations about the killing?”
“No.”
“No. And in terms of Jim Elstad, other than when he called you from the hospital, have you had any further contact with him?”
“No.”
“If I could back up for just a moment?” Raynor asked.
“Sure,” Rainey replied.
“In fact, were Elstad and Brown ever at your house on that evening till eleven fifteen or eleven thirty?”
“I don’t think so.”
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�So you don’t have any further contact with Jim Elstad other than that phone conversation?”
“That’s right.”
“Was there anything distinctive about the gun in terms of damage, or any kind of wear pattern to it, or anything like that?” Rainey asked, getting back to basics.
“I never held the gun, I never fired the gun, didn’t even want to pay attention to the gun,” answered Mary emphatically. “Had all this not come down with my son, I’d’ve picked up the phone and called the police and told them these kids got a gun. I know how gang members get. They all sit around and talk nonsense.”
“Did the gun look newer to you versus beat-up or anything? What did it look like to you?”
“The gun looked like a thirty-eight.”
“Color?”
“It looked like a black gun. Or the correct terminology, a blue gun.”
Mary really knew her weapons. Only someone familiar with revolvers would know that what seems like a black color on gun metal is actually blue, the result of a bluing process done at the factory.
“In terms of the numerous contacts you had with Crazy Joe after the killing, did he continue to make statements to you about the killing?”
“No. He made statements about getting caught.”
“What were those statements?”
“That they’d never really catch him.”
“Why did he think that?”
“I don’t know why he thought that.”
“Was there any conversation with you and Joe about him feeling like he needed to take additional precautions to keep from getting caught?”
“No.”
“Did Crazy Joe ever express any remorse about what had happened?”
“No! They didn’t act, they didn’t act panicked. They didn’t act upset about it at all. I thought they should. I thought there should be, at least, you know, some remorse. And they never said. ‘Oh, I feel bad. I feel bad for me, I feel bad for Aaron. I feel bad for his family.’ They never said none of that.”
“But how can you be sure of what they said if the only one you had any real contact with was Crazy Joe?”
“Joe yesterday …” Mary began, then her voice trailed off as she realized she had been caught in a lie. Without giving her a chance to explain, Rainey continued, “Mary, it’s still not clear to me, in terms of at least Crazy Joe anyway. After the killing. Did he make other statements to you regarding the killing?”