Waiting for the Punch

by Marc Maron

  Marc

  In general.

  Tom

  Nice enough to marry for five months, at least.

  Marc

  I’ve been married twice, man.

  Tom

  I think the thing is, you’ve got to imagine what would it be like for you—What’s your first wife’s name?

  Marc

  Kim.

  Tom

  What would it be like for you if every time you left your house, every day, for the rest of your life, between five and ten people, between the time you left your house and got back home, came up to you and said, “Hey, how’s Kim?”

  “You talked to Kim lately?”

  “Oh, I remember, you’re with Kim.”

  “Weren’t you married to that Kim?”

  Welcome to my life.

  The tendency is to want to just rant about it. It’s just so not really a viable option to go around ranting about why it went wrong. First of all, I’m sure she has a completely different opinion about why it went wrong. We don’t really have any relationship anymore. I haven’t talked to her in probably seven or eight years. We were living together, we were married. When she left the house that day, when we decided to get a divorce, I have never seen her since. That was over ten years ago but still, her name gets brought up every day.

  It’s an odd thing. You want to go, “Oh, this is what went wrong and this has happened and she did this, she did that, blah, blah, blah.” Then you just sound like some jerk walking around complaining about America’s sweetheart. I just chose to say nothing until now.

  NICK GRIFFIN—COMEDIAN, WRITER

  People ask, “How is she?” I go, “I have no idea, literally.”

  What’s funny is that the divorce itself, I said, “This isn’t working out. I’m going to move out for a little while,” and she says, “If you move out we’re getting divorced,” and I said, “Oh, whatever.” She went into the other room, she came back in with divorce papers. You can get them off the Internet, start the process. She put them down and I thought it was like a line in the sand. Like, “He won’t do it.” And I signed it and she walked out and then said, “You need to be out in a couple days.”

  I didn’t really think about it very much. I ran into somebody a week after I moved out and she said, “I saw your wife the other day,” and I say, “We got separated,” and she says, “Yes, I thought it was weird because she was with some guy,” and I was like, “Oh boy, that’s not good.”

  AMY POEHLER—COMEDIAN, WRITER, PRODUCER, ACTOR

  At this age, you have to find people that are already divorced. At least once. If you’re in your forties, and you’re a man, and you haven’t been divorced at least once, there’s something up.

  SARAH SILVERMAN—COMEDIAN, WRITER, ACTOR

  My parents became like brother and sister after the divorce. They’re like army buddies. They went through hell together a lifetime ago, and they just love each other so much. It’s really sweet. My stepmom is friends with my mom.

  My mom got really sick. She has this really rare disease, and this happened in ’93 to ’94. My stepmother, who’s terrified of needles and can’t look at the sight of blood, is her blood type. She had a blood transfusion for my mom. They love each other.

  My mom’s new neighbors were over, and she was introducing them to my dad and my stepmother. She said, “This is Donald, my ex-husband, and this is Janice, his beautiful and incredibly patient wife.”

  Marc

  Is your husband your first love?

  TERRY GROSS—RADIO HOST

  Now that I really know what love is, I’d say yes but …

  Marc

  What was the other thing?

  Terry

  This gets really personal. I was married once before.

  Marc

  For how long?

  Terry

  A short time and we were very close and it was a year maybe.

  It makes me nervous to talk about.

  I was very young. We were still in college. I was twenty, maybe. We got married quickly. I don’t know. We’d already been living together for a while. Time seems different when you’re young. A year is a really long time.

  My parents weren’t okay with anything I was doing then. I did this whole “I’ve got to do what I’ve got to do and you can’t tell me,” but my heart was breaking because it’s like, “I don’t want to hurt them,” but at the same time I felt like I had to cut the string and that if I gave in that it would always feel to them like, “She’s our good daughter. Everything is under control,” and I just had to do it.

  Marc

  Did you marry the guy to sort of say, “I’m my own person?”

  Terry

  We loved each other. It was a beautiful relationship. It was good. At some point we were living with a group of people because it was the 1960s and 1970s and people shared the housework and the cooking and at some point I realized, “You know what I really need? I need to live alone.”

  I just need to find out who I am outside of the group, outside of a marriage. I was too young to be committed. I think a lot of women go through this and I think when I came of age and I started college in 1968, it was kind of understood like you grow up, you get married, you have children, and even if you have a job, that’s the trajectory. I knew I wanted a different life and I knew to have that life, I needed to know who I was without picking up on what other people wanted of me or asked of me or projected on me or any of that. That required just having some room totally by myself, which I’d never had in my life.

  JANE LYNCH—COMEDIAN, ACTOR, SINGER

  I live with my ex. It’s great. We get along, and it’s great. We’re roommates. Well, we don’t like sleep in the same bed, we have our own rooms.

  We’re like copilots in life. She’s also my assistant when I need one.

  She’s really a perfect human being. She’s even more perfect than when we dated. I have several exes where that would never happen.

  I think that romance is the problem. I think the expectation that comes with romance. Romantic thinking like, this is going to be something, is going to complete me. I mean, “You complete me?” It’s bullshit.

  I do a live stage show. We do a medley of songs, love songs. We sing the stuff, you know we were brought up with these notions. You know, “Let it please be him,” and “I won’t last a day without you.”

  I started out singing that song “It All Depends on You,” and in between each phrase I go, “You know, a romantic relationship is basically bullshit.”

  I basically had a renaissance in terms of thinking, and I’m done with the romance. It’s stupid. I’m a happy girl right here, right now.

  JILL SOLOWAY—WRITER, DIRECTOR, PRODUCER

  I still have relationships with a couple of my exes. I wouldn’t really spend a ton of time with any of them, because I don’t think it’s good to do. I’m in a new romantic relationship. No need to dabble.

  That’s the difference, I think. That’s the difference in this relationship from all others. I have no interest in getting hits. I’m not trying to find out if I can fuck this up, I just actually literally want it to last forever.

  Every past relationship I thought at least every day, or every week, “Is this the right relationship? Should I get out?” I didn’t really believe in the whole soul mate thing, so I just like to kind of make odd choices instead.

  I actually wasn’t fishing in deep enough waters, I was sort of taking anybody. Probably people I could have control over. They all felt awesome, and fun, and they felt like love, and they were intense. If somebody caught my interest I would never think to myself, “Oh, this isn’t going anywhere.” I really didn’t believe that Mr. Right was out there, so I wasn’t trying to save myself for Mr. Right. I thought it was all a big lie. I thought it was a big fucking cosmic joke that when you meet the person that’s the right person you just know. I thought that was like the biggest fucking joke ever. I didn’t want to play in any of those little fiel
ds, trying to attract an awesome man. That seems like a dumb game.

  CONAN O’BRIEN—TALK SHOW HOST, COMEDIAN, WRITER

  When I came out to Los Angeles, I met all these people. In 1985 I came out here, and over time I met all these people. It’s the same cast of characters. I mean, everyone just keeps popping up, and it is funny that you’re assigned a set of characters when you’re born, and they keep showing up in your life. That’s just how it works. I do think God, and whatever God means, I really believe that there is a force in the universe that has a sense of humor. These things are just too weird.

  MEL BROOKS—COMEDIAN, WRITER, DIRECTOR, PRODUCER, ACTOR, MUSICIAN

  I spend almost every other night with Carl Reiner. Three nights a week I’ll be at Carl’s house. Carl loves, more than anything, what he calls “reallies” that we do. Carl is so proud that we do them only for ourselves. We don’t do them for an audience, we don’t do them for another person. We try to really amaze each other with where we’re going with our minds, you know? We’re still pretty good at it.

  Marc

  You guys sit and hang out for an hour or two.

  CARL REINER—COMEDIAN, WRITER, DIRECTOR, PRODUCER, ACTOR

  About three or four hours. Sometimes while we’re watching something he’ll fall asleep and I won’t wake him because he drives home and I’m saying, “Better he sleeps here than falls asleep behind the wheel.”

  Marc

  What was that thing you told me about movies? You two like watching movies with certain phrases in them.

  Carl

  Oh yeah, that’s true. The Bourne Series and movies like that. The phrases are, “Secure the perimeter! Lock all doors!” Or a character in the movie says, “Get some rest.” If those words are in the movie, that movie’s a good movie.

  Marc

  As you get older you don’t see people as much anymore.

  ROB REINER—DIRECTOR, PRODUCER, WRITER, ACTOR

  That’s true. I think it has to do with—You know that whole thing they say, where you’re born alone, you die alone? That bit?

  Well, I think what happens as you get older, you start thinking about that, and also that you don’t want to spend any time with anybody that’s going to annoy you or make it uncomfortable. As you get older, you realize that there are more and more people that annoy you. So your world keeps narrowing, and getting narrower.

  I think it’s unconscious. I don’t think you’re consciously saying, “I think I’m going to narrow my world now.” No, you think, “You know, I don’t really like that person that much, so why should I stay?” It’s like when you’re young, you’d never leave a movie theater until the movie’s over. Now you go, “Why do I have to watch the last hour of this piece of crap?” Because I have such a limited time on the planet.

  Marc

  And now with phones and computers, it’s like all the time is eaten up, unnecessarily eaten up.

  Rob

  Yes, and you trick yourself into believing that you’re actually communicating with people. You know, I’m texting, I’m e-mailing, I’m doing. You’re not talking to anybody. You’re talking to a computer.

  Here’s the thing. You look at this show like Friends, right? You’ve got all these people, they’re in their, I guess their twenties or something. They’re hanging out with each other, and I guess that’s what you do, you go in packs, but when you get into your thirties, your forties, your fifties, you don’t do that anymore. You got kids, you hang out with them, and then when you get older you don’t think, “Hey let’s go and hang out at the coffee shop.” You don’t do it.

  Marc

  Maybe you get one guy.

  Rob

  Yeah, one guy.

  Marc

  I talked to your father. He says he hangs out with Mel almost every night.

  Rob

  Mel. Mel and my dad, virtually every single night.

  Marc

  That’s really something.

  Rob

  Listen, it’s wonderful that they have each other. They met each other when they were in their twenties, and to have that kind of bond, and to have that bond stick. They make each other laugh, they enjoy each other’s company. They both lost their spouses recently, so they have that.

  And they watch any movie that has “Secure the perimeter!” in it.

  JACK BLACK—COMEDIAN, MUSICIAN, ACTOR, MEMBER OF TENACIOUS D

  Kyle Gass is my jelly. Without Kyle I’m just delicious, delicious peanut butter, which is fine on its own. Actually some people prefer it, but when you add it to jelly, it makes something unbelievably delicious.

  Now, why would I turn my back on my jelly? Once you find your jelly, there’s just no reason to keep searching.

  Marc

  Was the jelly bothering you to do another record?

  Jack

  No, in fact the jelly was talking about breaking up. We always break up, it’s a fiery relationship. Not really. Sometimes. We’re like brothers. We’re highly competitive with each other and there’s a lot of love and there’s also an endless battle for control. In the band and also in life. We’re both on diets right now. Kyle won’t tell you, but he’s secretly hoping to win and be lighter than …

  KYLE GASS—COMEDIAN, MUSICIAN, ACTOR, MEMBER OF TENACIOUS D

  I’ll tell you. Of course I want to encourage you by winning.

  Jack

  By winning and holding it over me.

  Marc

  There’s no denying the fact that at some point, Tenacious D happened and then Jack Black: Movie Star happened. Now, was the jelly upset?

  Kyle

  The jelly did fall off the bread a little bit. It’s always that. It’s a half-full, half-empty sort of thing. On one hand, this partnership has been the greatest thing ever for me, but then on the other hand it’s like, “Wait a minute, how come I’m not starring in my own movies? How come I can walk through an airport so easily? What’s happening here?” Then you have to reconcile, “Well, I don’t know. That’s just the way it is.”

  For a while, I would just really start a lot of side projects.

  There is that feeling like, “Wait, let me see how good I can do on my own.” Then failing time after time, I realized that without Jack, I am nothing.

  Jack

  It’s not true.

  Kyle

  I’ve accepted it. Really, I’ve become much happier.

  CHEECH MARIN—COMEDIAN, WRITER, ACTOR, MEMBER OF THE DUO CHEECH AND CHONG

  It was always volatile between us. We were always arguing.

  We’re not like best friends. People always say, “Oh, you guys must be best friends, you’ve known each other forever.”

  We’re brothers!

  So you can fight with your brother. But he’s still your brother. That’s really the kind of the connection we have.

  I don’t know, you come to a point where you just don’t want to hear what the other guy has to say, you know? Both of us.

  TOMMY CHONG—COMEDIAN, WRITER, ACTOR, MEMBER OF THE DUO CHEECH AND CHONG

  I think what happened is that Cheech got divorced and I was part of the divorce settlement.

  “Okay, you get Chong and I get the house.”

  Cheech

  Yeah, yeah, okay. That’s a good deal.

  JACK BLACK

  Kyle never ever has any interest in coming over to the house.

  KYLE GASS

  I haven’t been invited once.

  Jack

  That’s not true, I do invite you over.

  Marc

  Why don’t you go there? By the way, I’ve received zero invites over to your ranch since you’ve lived there.

  Jack

  The Jelly Ranch.

  Kyle

  I think what it is, is that when we work together we see a lot of each other. I think the natural breaks are good, but I do enjoy seeing the kids when they do pop up.

  Jack

  Sometimes I invite Kyle over and he’s like, “I’ve already seen that m
ovie. I’ve got better things to do.”

  Kyle

  Oh my God.

  CARRIE BROWNSTEIN

  Corin Tucker is still one of my best friends, so despite going through that kind of rough phase of Sleater-Kinney and then the breakup of the band, which does end up feeling a little bit divorce-like, we’re still really good friends. We dated for a second when we were nineteen and twenty. She’s married with two kids now.

  People really focused on that even though in my mind, I’m like, “Doesn’t everybody do that?” It’s fine, I have nothing to hide, but it was just one of those things. I still remember reading a review after Sleater-Kinney played a show in New York, and the reviewer mentioned it. It was years later, I’d just been to Corin’s wedding. But if you don’t provide people with a narrative, people will provide one for you. We were never good at self-mythologizing in Sleater-Kinney. I think when you don’t do that, someone will just fill it in for you.

  PAUL THOMAS ANDERSON—WRITER, DIRECTOR, PRODUCER

  We all kind of started out together. Me. John C. Reilly. Philip Seymour Hoffman. They had a little bit more of a résumé underneath them. Which was really helpful, even if they made four or five films, that was more than I’d done. When we were starting out, they had my back and they were really helpful. Like, “That’s where craft service is,” the simplest things. Just having a few movies under your belt makes a big difference.

  But you know, Phil was like, he maybe had a long list of kind of not-so-great movies, but he would always be the best thing in it, you know?