A Fire Upon the Deep

by Vernor Vinge

  * PRB QU Do I have to bring up explicitly an explanation for why the Org can’t just use some of the allegedly fantastic wealth the Old One paid them earlier in comm fees?

  * [vsv] See Pham’s comments a few paragraphs on SOLN ? see also hld comment on this earlier Maybe it’s already been spent

  * [jrf] Yes, you have one ie: while giving big fees, the cash flow probably isn’t instant, ie it is spread out over a term. They need help with this now; also the Power has better access tool

  * RETRO PRO “possessed” for “tele-operated”

  * [ur] FRAG : The jackass had a point: there was a fundamental paradox in analyzing a mind greater than your own. It was the paradox that underlay all Applied Theology, and split the field into Bean Counter and Analogist factions. But I never thought it would have such a personal meaning!

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  Note 474

  * [vsv] INCON usual bandwidth CHK needed here

  June 11, 1991 must match this properly with what Old One is apparently using just before the Fall of Relay

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  Note 475

  * [vsv] Here is a good place to sharpen [rationalize] what Powers can do in the lower Zones:

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  Note 476

  * QU Is this comment about “single wild evening” clear? plausible? appropriate?

  * [JLC] Yes.

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  Note 477

  * [jrf] Why?

  * [vsv] Just that he seems affected by serious hurt/problems in others.

  * [jrf2] Okay.

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  Note 478

  * [vsv] cf discussion of “automation” in the Prolog. Pham is using the term in an even more extended way.

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  Note 479

  * QU are these characters/dialogue too sappy? stupid? QU Maybe should rephrase to make what she had been thinking of doing less likely of success. Thus, she doesn’t seem so childish for allowing herself to be swept away by temper

  * ID QU Might earlier have her thinking to herself, wondering why Pham gets her so blinking mad (and hopefully do this without considering the possibility that she is in love with him)

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  Note 480

  * QU Delete clause “when his whole existence was a fraud.”?

  * [vsv] QU should I foreshadow here that the idea expressed here is to cause mucho grief for a long time <— probably NÆH

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  Note 481

  * [vsv] IMPER If you go with internal PoV for Pham’s death, it might be a real good idea to have it assumed through most of the story that he is a fraud

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  Note 482

  * ID QU ness (but presented indirectly as in As the Gentle Rain) : have there be evidence that Ravna is manipulated by the Org? Hmm, I really don’t like the idea; I like stories where I have some characters who feel responsible for their own actions —and that should be the case for humans at least up to the Middle Beyond

  * CHK how much could really be said on one breath

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  Note 483

  * [jrf] too baldfaced

  * [vsv] Not sure which you mean here. What do you recommend I change/delete so not to be baldfaced here?

  * [jrf2] I mean her insult, which is very harsh and not, ultimately, accurate, is too vicious for a response to his insult to her. She doesn’t seem like the vindictive type; I’d think she’d stop short of such a detailed, deep analysis of his personality and memories. Is she so sure? Maybe she can say this, but then second guess herself.

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  Note 484

  * [vsv] ID QU A couple of SIDE bars. One showing that Pan Commodities has finally fallen (or maybe that the expansion has slowed?), and the other an off the wall speculation that maybe the Blight is not Class 2 but something unknown. <— this might respond to jdv’s complaint that things are too untense at beginning of the picnic scene

  * IDEA Computers as the cutting edge of truth. Collisions with objective fact happen at a higher rate for me with computers than in any other endeavor.

  * ? ID for R3. “Don’t give me that hall of mirrors routine”

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  Note 485

  * [jrf2] [ur] Big question in re Old One: As one not of the Beyond, and until I read the whole book not knowing everything, I found Old One confusing for a long time. The problem was that the Perversion and Pham appear at their respective times very close to each other. (And the huge surge used by Old One is very threatening and in some ways sounds like a potential Perversion ploy.) In hindsight I realize that Pham was Old One’s response to the Perversion, and Old One is basically, a good god (as it were). But for a long time it’s very tempting to think Old One is an Aspect (if you will) of the Perversion. Can you drop hints before now that this is not the case, ie, establish Old One’s credentials and credibility sooner. It’s a distraction now.

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  Note 486

  * [vsv] This is also a place to downgrade the bottom lugger nature of the OOB. One thing it does have is the ramscoop, and a good ultradrive for the bottom

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  Note 487

  * INCON QU Is “lizard” incon with later “sowbug” image?

  * [vsv] [ur] June 8, 1991 “abyssal fish” doesn’t quite fit the rest of the sentence. also conflict perhaps with the “moth” imagery elsewhere

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  Note 488

  * [vsv] CHK INCON 30 Kb/s; But you need 15KB/s (120Kb/s) to support the message rate you talk about toward the end of the story. SOLN This may not be a problem. Early in the flight, OOB is relatively higher in the Beyond. And at the climax, there are enormous net resources (probably larger than what Grondr was planning for here) that were aimed at the OOB and the pursuing fleets.

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  Note 489

  * [vsv] CHK that you haven’t had this sentence about Tines too repetitively elsewhere

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  Note 490

  * PRB getting this conversation to be both a lead in to the next scene and being consistent with the amount of time that I say has passed

  Seems like this following could be improved anyway. For instance, how can I give some indication of grief about his parents.

  * [ur] single line space deleted for now January 26, 1991

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  Note 491

  * PRB should have more about the fact that Ravna and company are doing research on the pack race (there’s a little bit about this in 10.txt)

  * MG ID: thinks a map should/could be included

  * [vsv] Yes, what about this (most important) my galactic map — but also maybe a map of the Northwest around Hidden Island

  * [vsv] I think I did the following stuff about Relay much earlier c06)

  There is some mention in c07:

  * [MG] ID : Make the point that Relay is an astrophysical anomaly Namely position (with metal rich) plus having planetsMaybe heavy transmutationMight ask Freddy

  * mARK 21Aug89

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  Note 492

  * [vsv] June 8, 1991 The flight of the refugee ship from High Lab to Tines world took 21d (by my current CHRON )

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  Note 493

  * PRO use or delete this hanging reference to gadgets handy for the rescue

  * [vsv] Just make sure they didn’t get loaded CHK

  small INCON They probably should have been planning to relay through Relay

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  Note 494

  * [jdv] Preparation section for voyage seems kind of slow. The fact that the Blight is advertised as slowing down makes it less grabbing their mission to the bottom. May want to reveal to the reader that this is a false slowing down

  * [vsv] should I have ominous narrator statement here (“If we had but known the horror that soon…”)

/>   * [jrf2] Rather than something so portentous, how about some cautionary words about the potential changeability of a blight’s pattern of growth and/or activity?

  * [vsv] for the sake of not being so coincidental, you might have this not be the same evening as the conversation with Jefri

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  Note 495

  * [vsv] June 8, 1991 Not clear to me why it slowed up; unless it had something to do with its planning an attack on Old One

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  Note 496

  * IDEA an immune system race (maybe just as a node on the net)

  * IMP PRB Explanation why refugee ship doesn’t have agrav

  SIDEbar progress and the “rotation” of space and time

  * PRB Do you ever make it clear why Helper does not have the latest topo information

  * [ur] ?? REN include names of gimmicks: ultradrive etc

  * REN mechrobe mecrobe mechcrobe microbe — like nanotech assemblers

  * [jrf] explain once.

  * [vsv] The 04Jan91 manuscript has no mention of mecrobes; I intend to preserve that omission!

  * REN “mecrobial infestations” Log19 has some notes about technology at various levels. Should CHK that it has been incorporated (say in BKG )

  * PRB Somewhere have to make clear the spatial limitations of agrav and that it is not really a drive

  * [vsv] There is an implication in c00

  * QU What are symptoms of hypoxia? TUF June 13, 1991

  * IMP —> INCON What about the ultra light spines on the refugee ship

  * [vsv] IMP There are several related inconsistencies

  * [vsv] picture of the Fall of Relay on the back of Log20

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  Note 497

  * [vsv] June 8, 1991 PRB Implication again that skrode contains long-term memory; suggest deleting the reference here

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  Note 498

  * [vsv] CHK the timing here

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  Note 499

  * [ur] page 242, INSERT G:

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  Note 500

  * PRB QU You use brrp! a lot starting about here. Decide on consistent, moderate use — brap brrap never brrp anymore.

  * [vsv] It’s just here and c37, which may be okay as these are both places of some tension

  * [ur] ID Hmm, I wonder whether this hooks up with the Riders Secret — certainly it might be cited by Pham later on

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  Note 501

  * PRB I need some reasonable way that they can be convinced that Pham has not been taken over by the Blight (ie, the Blight masquerading as Old One)

  * NÆH ID How about just “secretary” (program) instead of “associate” (program)?

  * IDEA 31Jul89 In the future, antique machines (like my mother’s box camera, but from post 1985) will almost never be usable: incompatible batteries, chip formats

  * PRB in fast reading, that you talk disaster before you see it is jarring

  Is this truly INCON with the 4000 figure quoted later in this chapter?

  * [vsv] RETRO write this Org ethics stuff

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  Note 502

  * [vsv] but different nervous systems?

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  Note 503

  * [vsv] June 8, 1991 Maybe “a main transceiver”

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  Note 504

  * [vsv] Undo “buzz” attribute when the two Riders are talking to each other

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  Note 505

  * INCON Presumably this is receiver gear. Why wasn’t it ever noticed by the Vrinimi Org? (I think this is a problem even if you don’t use the gear to gruesome effect in this scene)

  * [vsv] Note that the receiver gear is mentioned in c19

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  Note 506

  * [vsv] NÆH : INCON PRO write. This sophisticated failure might be cited later as clearing the Skroderiders of complicity (too a weak defense, actually).

  * [vsv] Hope somewhere you give some sort of nano explanation of all this.

  * [vsv] Failure not the right word here

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  Note 507

  * PRB REN QU Some substitute for “plasma jets” — something consistent with t1

  Also question of usage, “torch” v “jet”

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  Note 508

  * QU It’s actually somewhat less than one gee here. Do I need to write it more precisely? DONE

  * [hld] “rocket drive” —> “reaction drive” DONE

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  Note 509

  * [vsv] [ur] PRB INCON QU Is it bad you don’t explicitly explain why agrav and suits failed here (or maybe you do explain it somewhere?)

  * [vsv] [ur] But note that Ravna does question herself about this a few paragraphs earlier; it could be used by Pham to make his suspicions harsher. There could also be Net traffic about this IMP MSG

  * [MG] ID : Have Ravna not guess till a later

  * [MG] PRB : Why does all agrav fail on individual suits

  * [MG] ID BAK The Skroderiders can’t breed without civilization. Maybe lesser riders are ones that don’t have skrodes

  * [MG] ID BAK: Maybe the skrodes themselves reproduce. Ultimately this is important for the question of the fate the children of Blueshell and Greenstalk

  * [vsv] June 8, 1991 “abyssal fish”? “glowing moth”? Suggest you emphasize the spines more during her televisit to the ship (and how far out was the ship then?)

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  Note 510

  * [vsv] CHK INCON here is a size reference on OOB

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  Note 511

  * CHKd numbers given below about the fall and entry velocities

  * [vsv] d = 0.5at**2 ==> t = sqr(2d/a); d =~ 1000e6 m; a =~9 m/s**2; t = 471s; v = at = 4.24 km/s

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  Note 512

  * QU is this reference to panic too repetitive/conflicting with previous reference

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  Note 513

  * [ur] QU medical question about this comment on bluish cast

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  Note 514

  * PRB Not quite clear why she would have this familiarity

  * PRB QU Really though, wouldn’t “human specs” simply be what humans had ripped off from elsewhere?

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  Note 515

  * QU INCON How much do I have to work in this to make it consistent with Olsndot’s successful landing at the start of t1?

  * INCON PRB actually, with the materials available, it’s surprising that it couldn’t just incidentally aerobrake, especially at these relatively low speeds. Perhaps it’s plausible that the spines would be damaged, but there’s still some rephrasing necessary.

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  Note 516

  * QU What would be a good Riderish term for “tight spot”

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  Note 517

  * [vsv] INCON so what did the destruction of these inertial orbit places? Failed equipment, onboard explosions?

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  Note 518

  * [vsv] INCON QU breathing space?

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  Note 519

  * ID QU Consider using the term “window” more than “display”

  * [vsv] SOLN to following: Grondr had told them to go!

  * QU Does it seem bad that OOB is not trying to rescue any of the failing ships? jlc: No.

  * [jrf] Wrong. It’s bad not to say why they’re not trying

  * [jrf2] You could fix this right after “hopefully” above: Something like: Blueshell saying that there was/is fighting, but not right around them yet, but what’s horrible is knowing that there are lots of people and ships that they are absolutely unable to help, if they are to have any chance to survive and escape.

  * [vsv] Yes, unfortunately, I don’t quite see
where to fit it in yet

  Hmm, this may be connected with the other INCON of too much high speed junk

  I think I’ve finished with my flashback to Grondr’s parting remark (see below)

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  Note 520

  * [vsv] Maybe say that such rescue infrastructure is one of the main things destroyed

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  Note 521

  * QU are you using the term “out-system” consistently?

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  Note 522

  * [ur] Following paragraph doesn’t quite make sense:

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  Note 523

  * CHK on BKG INCON keep track of status of spines for the sake of consistency

  * [vsv] June 14, 1991 After this scene 2 dead, 3 “repaired” see c22c24

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  Note 524

  * qU Should I make it more explicit that this is the Perversion that is attacking?

  * [JLC] Yes.

  * QU argh. Does it seem that the “author’s attitude” toward the Skroderiders is becoming patronizing/racist? How serious is this?