Lilja's Library

by Hans-Ake Lilja

  Lilja: Is it easier to write a script if you do it like Storm of the Century, an original script, or is it easier to base a script on a book?

  Stephen King: I think originals are always easier, and I think that scripts that are adapted are always easier when they are based on shorter works and I think those actually turn out a little bit better. I think that both The Mist and 1408 from last year are really good movies and both are based on shorter works. When you get a long book it’s kinda like trying to stuff everything into a suitcase, and that can be very difficult. Duma Key has been optioned for movies and it may actually become a movie, but I was surprised that it happened because it’s a story that has so much plot in it, it would really have to be simplified. Lisey’s Story, on the other hand, would make a great TV miniseries if it was done in the right way.

  Lilja: Yeah.

  Stephen King: What are you watching now?

  Lilja: I’m actually watching LOST. We’re a couple of episodes behind you, but that’s an interesting show.

  Stephen King: Yeah, it is. It’s interesting, it’s an interesting show, has interesting format and…yeah, it’s good.

  Lilja: It’s going to be very interesting to see how they will tie it all up in the end.

  Stephen King: You know what? I think they will actually be able to.

  Lilja: Yeah? I hope so. Speaking about The Mist. I just saw it recently and I must say that it’s a really good movie.

  Stephen King: Yeah, I think it is.

  Lilja: It really survived very well in the transformation from story to movie. What are your feelings about Frank’s new ending?

  Stephen King: I thought it was good. The ending was obviously gonna be controversial, but he had to put an ending to it, the story really doesn’t have an ending. Before it could become a movie it had to be tied up. He couldn’t just leave them there on the road, which is what I did. And he became more and more convinced that the ending should be what the ending was when he did it. And originally it looked like it was going to be a Paramount movie and that they were gonna make it for a big budget, you know, like I Am Legend money, like eighty million, ninety million dollars, but they wanted Frank to change the ending before they would do that. And Frank tried a number of different things, God bless him…I mean, there is nothing wrong with that guy’s heart or his willingness to work with other people, and none of it really rang true, nothing really worked, so eventually he did the deal with The Weinsteins for Dimension Films. And they said “Yes, we’ll go ahead and do it your way, but we’ll only go in for like seventeen million dollars,” so they kinda shot it quick and dirty.

  Lilja: Yeah, and I think that was good for this one.

  Stephen King: Yeah, I think so too. One thing that is interesting is that when the DVD comes out, which is fairly soon now, there’s going to be two versions. There’ll be the version that was released in theatres and there’ll be another one that will be in black and white.

  Lilja: Yeah, that one should be interesting.

  Stephen King: Yeah, that’s kind of the way that he wanted to do it from the very beginning. That will be interesting.

  Lilja: I just have one more question and then I’ll let you go.

  Stephen King: OK…

  Lilja: What about The Talisman 3? Any news on that?

  Stephen King: [laughs] You mean the third section?

  Lilja: Yeah.

  Stephen King: Well, I talk to Peter about it, and the real problem isn’t working with Peter because I love to work with Peter and we actually have a really good idea for this book and I’m sure it’ll happen in time, but right now what it would mean is backing off and rereading those first two books and getting kinda back into the groove a bit, and that’s the part that’s kinda holding me back, that’s daunting. That’s a lot of story there to beat around with, to work around so…

  Lilja: It’s about the same as when you were doing the last three Dark Tower books; you had to read up on them…

  Stephen King: That’s exactly what I was thinking of, yeah…

  Lilja: I hope it won’t be too long though…

  Stephen King: This was great. I’ll talk to you again.

  Lilja: Yeah, I hope we can do this again.

  Stephen King: OK, take care.

  Lilja: Bye.

  Section 2—Other Interviews

  Tyson Blue

  Posted: September 14, 2000

  Lilja: First, let me take this opportunity to thank you for letting me read your book, Walking the Mile—The Making of “The Green Mile,” and doing this interview. I really enjoyed the book. It’s well written and a great read!

  Tyson Blue: Well, thank you. It’s great to hear that kind of reaction after two long years of writing and rewriting!

  Lilja: Please tell me a bit about yourself. How did you end up writing this book?

  Tyson Blue: I was asked to do it by Frank Darabont, who remembered reading my work in the old Castle Rock newsletter back when we were both much younger. His memory was jogged when I contacted him about visiting the set while they were on location, and he ended up asking me to cover the whole picture.

  Lilja: Tell me a bit about this book. When will it be released and by what publisher?

  Tyson Blue: I wish I knew! I thought this would be a no-brainer—the first making-of book about a King film. But a lot of these books have tanked, and publishers are leery. There has been some interest in doing a limited edition from Cemetery Dance Publications, and I’m toying with the notion of doing it electronically, but all that’s a ways off yet.

  Lilja: It’s not the first time you wrote about King, right? Tell me a little about the other stuff you have written about King.

  Tyson Blue: I have written two books about King and his work, The Unseen King, now sadly out of print, and Observations From the Terminator, which has managed to put two small presses out of business without quite being published. Dave Hinchberger has expressed some interest in that book, so it may yet see the light of day.

  I’ve also written hundreds and hundreds of articles, essays, interviews and reviews about King and his work, which have appeared in newspapers and magazines around the world, including Twilight Zone, Midnight Graffiti, Cemetery Dance, Footsteps and others. Abroad, I’ve appeared in Canada in Fenetre Secrete sur Stephen King, in Italy in Cleaver, in Germany in Horror-News and the French magazines Steve’s Rag and Tenebres. I’ve contributed to all of Steve Spignesi’s King books, and have, as he points out, written more about King and his work than anyone else on the planet.

  Lilja: Have you ever met King in person?

  Tyson Blue: Yes, four times. It’s been an enjoyable experience. He’s hard to get to, but if you ever get the chance, I think you’ll find him very approachable and easy to talk with.

  Lilja: Frank Darabont, who directed The Green Mile, has done two other movies based on King’s work, The Woman in the Room and The Shawshank Redemption. All three movies have been nominated for Oscars, but none of them have won any. Do you have any theory as to why that is? They seem to have been big hits with the public…

  Tyson Blue: I think it’s been a combination of bad breaks. A lot of the Oscar voting is influenced by huge publicity campaigns involving tons of money, and lesser films have unfortunately had more push behind them. But if you look at the status of those films on the IMDb, it speaks pretty eloquently. I mean, is there ANYONE out there who thinks that a piece of crap like American Beauty is really better than The Green Mile?

  Lilja: In the book you talk about some documentary filming done by Constantine Nasr. What happened to all that? Was it cut down to the documentary that is on the DVD version of the movie or will there be a longer documentary about it?

  Tyson Blue: Yes, and yes. Yes, the 130 hours of video that Constantine shot was pared down to the documentary on the DVD; also, yes, I understand that a longer version will be included on the VHS release when it appears priced to own later this year.

  Lilja: Speaking of movies in movies, will Wild Bil
l Goes to Hollywood [read the review to know what this is] ever be shown to the public?

  Tyson Blue: I lobbied very hard for it to be put on the DVD, but Frank thought it was too much of an in-joke. But I’ll keep hoping; hope, as they say, is a good thing…

  Lilja: After having the opportunity to follow the making of this movie, did it turn out as you thought it would when you attended the screening?

  Tyson Blue: It was everything I hoped for and more. I thought it was by far the best translation of a King novel to the screen, and that the changes Frank made were for the better. There were a couple of scenes and shots I wish had stayed in, but the overall result is so fine, I just can’t argue much with it.

  Lilja: I know you tell us about a favorite moment from your visit on the set in the book (no, I won’t reveal it here). Is there any other moment you feel like sharing, one that isn’t in the book?

  Tyson Blue: Yeah. I didn’t put it in the book, but I got to be one of the mourners at Elaine Connelly’s funeral near the end of the film; I’m seated to the right of the coffin, next to a woman in black, in the shot of the graveside service. Constantine is the man in the black suit standing at the front end of that row, by the way. I’m easy to spot; no one else moved in the shot.

  Lilja: What’s next for you? Any new books in the making?

  Tyson Blue: For now, it’s back to my regular job as an attorney; I recently re-entered private practice, and that takes a lot of time. I’m also working on starting up And I In Dreams Behold, a suspense novel I put aside two years ago when The Green Mile came along. I’m also looking to place Observations From the Terminator, and have been asked to do an essay for Steve Spignesi’s new King book. I’m definitely open to doing more work with Frank Darabont, if possible, but that’s a ways off yet. And I’ll keep writing my regular King news columns and anything else that comes along. There’s always something.

  ****

  James Cole

  Posted: October 27, 2000

  Lilja: Please start this off by giving us some general information about yourself, including a list of all the work you’ve done in the movie busi-ness.

  James Cole: I grew up in New England and began making short films when I was eleven. I began writing seriously in college, and have been published in Castle Rock: The Stephen King Newsletter, The Stephen King Encyclopedia and The Lost Work of Stephen King, as well as Sci-Fi Universe and Video Watchdog magazines. I moved to California to pursue a writing career in 1991. I have been writing scripts for over ten years, but none have been produced as yet.

  Lilja: The reason why we’re interviewing you is because of the short movie for Stephen King’s “The Last Rung on the Ladder,” for which you paid one dollar for the rights. When did you shoot this film? How much did it cost to produce? How many official airings have there been, and could you tell us about a funny incident from the production of the movie?

  James Cole: Production on The Last Rung on the Ladder began in 1986 when I was twenty. I had moved to a small town in Cape Cod in 1984 and met Dan Thron, a fellow filmmaker and Stephen King fan. We decided to adapt this story in 1985, but could not find a suitable barn, so the project was abandoned. However, we decided to try again the following year. We found two local kids and useable locations, and shot for nine days during the summer of ’86. We had no crew and only two Super-8 cameras, but were able to accomplish a great deal.

  There was no single “funny incident” I can recall, but there were many moments of laughter from flubbed lines and goofing around. The kids were terrific (ages eleven and thirteen), and we had a lot of fun, despite the difficult settings and rushed schedule. The total cost was around fifteen hundred dollars—mostly for film and processing, plus the rental of editing equipment and the transfer to video.

  Lilja: How come you picked “The Last Rung on the Ladder” to develop into a movie? What is it in the story that you like so much?

  James Cole: Night Shift was one of the first Stephen King books I read. I discovered King at age thirteen or fourteen, and, though I don’t remember when exactly I read Night Shift, I loved every short story. However, as ninety percent of the stories are genuine horror, I remember being surprised and a bit confused when I began reading “The Last Rung on the Ladder.” Within a few pages I knew this was unlike the other stories; a simple story about a brother and sister set in another time. It immediately became one of my favorites, but I never imagined making it into a movie.

  When I met Dan Thron years later, we quickly compared favorite King works. It turned out he loved “The Last Rung on the Ladder” too, and for whatever reason, we decided to try and make it. The fact that it required no monsters, no makeup and no special effects was one factor in our choice. The biggest reason we chose it was simply because the story moved me. It made me cry the first time I read it, and I knew I wanted to see if I could faithfully adapt such a beautiful tale and have it work on screen.

  Lilja: The whole story behind the film can be read in your essay, “Why Kitty Absolutely Had to Die, or How I Made a Movie of a Stephen King Short Story For a Buck,” published in Stephen Spignesi’s Lost Work of Stephen King. In the essay you write that you wrote a script for a long version of the film, but didn’t get an OK from King at that point. A year later, you write, a man called Lucas Knight got the rights to the movie and started to look for you to get hold of your script. How come he got the rights, and what do you know about this upcoming version? Is it based on your script?

  James Cole: I adapted a feature version of The Last Rung on the Ladder as a personal challenge. I went ahead and did it without King’s permission, simply because I first wanted to see if it could be done, if a twelve-page story could be successfully expanded into two hours. I wrote three drafts between late 1992 and 1993. When I was satisfied, I then approached King about the rights or an option. Neither request was granted, so the script is in limbo. (Without King’s approval I obviously cannot sell the script.)

  I got word of Lucas Knight’s involvement with the same story through the Internet. The news terrified me because I was afraid he was doing his own feature version as well. Eventually he tracked me down, and I learned he was doing a short version, just like mine, only with a bigger budget (I guess you could call it a “remake”). So, to answer your question, he is not using my feature script. He wrote his own short script, and, as of only a few days ago, I heard from him for the first time in months. His script was finally approved by King and he begins shooting his film this summer. As to how he got the rights, I think it has to do with him being a local filmmaker. Stephen King often supports those in his home state, and the fact that Lucas had the support of a local PBS station might have convinced King.

  Lilja: Returning to the first (and still only) version—how did you find out that King sold the movie rights to some of his stories for just one dollar? Was it just a wild guess or did you know it before you sent him the check?

  James Cole: I don’t really remember. Though I had contacts with King fans in 1986, I did not know Spignesi nor the other “heavy hitters.” I think my contact was a gentleman named Craig Goden, who ran a book dealership in New Jersey. I had met him at a few Science Fiction conventions, and he sold King books. Through him, I discovered the Castle Rock Newsletter and some other contacts. Somehow I heard that I could do a student film of any of King’s short work as long as I didn’t try to market it or sell it or even show it without King’s permission.

  (FYI: that is not the same as “selling the movie rights.” Nothing was “sold” to me for one dollar. I did not, and do not, own any rights or option to the story. The dollar simply allowed me, a college student, to make the film.) So, I got King’s office address and sent him a check for one dollar. A month later the cashed check appeared in my bank statement…with King’s signature endorsing the check on the back! So, I knew I was “cleared” to make The Last Rung on the Ladder, and I did. The last part of this unwritten agreement was to send King a videotape of the completed film, and I did that too.r />
  Lilja: By making a movie for just one dollar, you are one of the “Dollar Babies,” as King himself has put it. Do you know who the other “Dollar Babies” are and what stories they have shot?

  James Cole: I only know two other “Dollar Babies.” One is well known: Frank Darabont. He shot The Woman in the Room in 1983 for a larger, more professional budget than myself. We all know he went on to make The Shawshank Redemption and The Green Mile. The other “Dollar Baby” is Jim Gonis, who filmed a faithful version of The Lawnmower Man (unlike the feature film). Jim made his film the same year I made The Last Rung on the Ladder (in 1987), at New York University film school. We met the following summer (I don’t remember how) and we’ve been friends ever since. Jim lives in Los Angeles as well. I don’t know the identities of any of the other “Dollar Babies,” but I sure would love to see their films! (I’ve only seen The Woman in the Room, The Boogeyman and The Lawnmower Man.)

  Lilja: Do you think there is any possibility that your The Last Rung on the Ladder will be available for anyone to see in the future? Doesn’t it bother you that people can’t see your work?

  James Cole: I can always hope. Of course it bothers me that people can’t see a film that has been written about so extensively in King publications. However, it is a film with limitations. It was shot on Super-8 with very little budget, so it certainly isn’t as professional looking in some respects as I’d like it to be. I believe that’s one reason King did not allow me to make a deal with an interested video company years ago.