We Matter

by Etan Thomas

  Etan: What gave you the courage to be able to take a stand like that?

  Reid: The answer again is my faith. Jesus walked this earth, He was ridiculed, He was mocked, and He was killed for doing His Father’s business. And if He could give that perfect example and lose His life for doing what was right, I can handle some backlash from the media. I can handle some people hiding behind their keyboard and calling me names and telling me to leave the country because that’s not real . . . So to me, it didn’t feel like it took much courage just to take a knee for what was right, when I follow Jesus who gave His life to save mine.

  Interview with Torrey Smith

  Some football players took heat for not supporting Kaepernick, but many people didn’t know about the internal discussions that took place throughout the entire NFL. My friend Torrey Smith, who once sat with me on a fatherhood panel with five of his fellow Baltimore Ravens, called me shortly after Kaepernick took his knee and told me about those discussions. Smith had been a 49ers teammate of Kaepernick’s when the controversy broke out. You hear a lot of the Kaepernick critics saying that he was a “distraction” for the team and that he was “splitting the locker room” by taking such a controversial stance, but what I hear from the actual players is quite the opposite. Kaepernick’s teammates voted to give him the Len Eshmont Award, named after the navy veteran and original member of the 1949 49ers, and given to the player who best exemplifies courage and inspiration. In this interview, Smith discusses his overall appreciation for his teammate’s courage and the tangible ways it changed even what the 49ers did in the community. He also talks about the dialogue nationwide that was sparked and the effectiveness of that dialogue.

  Etan: You don’t seem to mind mixing it up on social media.

  Torrey Smith: I’m never afraid to debate with anyone about anything. I feel that that’s a right that we all have. Oftentimes, with athletes in particular, there is this thought that we shouldn’t speak up about certain things, and I just don’t agree with that. I think it’s important to use your voice, and that goes for any and every person.

  Etan: Isn’t it interesting, though, that when people agree with you, they praise you for speaking out, but when they don’t agree with you, then you hear, “Shut up and play and just do your job”?

  Smith: (Laughing) It’s the definition of hypocrisy. But that’s just how humans are in general. People are all about what you can do for them and agreeing with you and being on your side when it is convenient or when it benefits them. Probably one of the biggest problems in our society is that people can’t disagree and be at peace. There’s always conflict. And people don’t listen . . . I have always tried to listen to people who I don’t agree with. To pay attention to their points and understand their points, and then form an opinion. And even if I don’t agree with you, I can respect your opinion and your perspective, and I feel that when you are an athlete, people don’t feel that way. They feel like if they don’t agree with what you say or your perspective, then it just doesn’t matter. You’re just a dumb jock and you don’t know what you are talking about.

  Etan: There has been a burst of NFL players speaking out these past few years—not just Colin Kaepernick. How do you explain this new wave of athlete activism, particularly in the NFL?

  Smith: I think, and this is just my personal opinion, currently there are conversations going on in the locker room that have never been had. I don’t want to say never, but the depth of those conversations among different groups of people has been a game changer in these past few seasons. The way that police brutality has been brought to the forefront. Or racism, or Donald Trump as president, or bigotry. And you have people talking in the locker room who will view these topics with an open mind, and others who don’t. You have people who are pro-Trump and like the fact that he is not like other politicians and isn’t politically correct and doesn’t play by any rules, and we have guys who are passionately against him and everything that he stands for. Guys that have said, “No, call it what it is.” But we are having the conversations together. And we are learning from each other’s perspectives to where guys are saying, “Wow, I didn’t think about it like that.” You have people who are personally affected by these police shootings on both sides.

  Etan: Talk to me about what happened after Kaepernick took his stance. Did you guys start discussing those issues more, or was it basically just about whether he stood or not?

  Smith: I think it was a combination of both. You had some people who were offended and some people who understood it. None of us knew that he was going to do this . . . This was something that he did on his own and he had been doing it for a few games, but no one noticed it. And when people caught wind of it, he spoke about it, explaining his positions and reasons, and I will always commend him for doing that . . . Even myself—we had a long talk and there was a point where I was going to do it with him, and I came to the conclusion that there were other ways to battle this. But I respect his way. So I gave him my support, told him how much I respect him and that I was going to continue to fight my way, but I didn’t think it was something that I would do because my dad was in the military. And when he dies, his casket will be draped in red, white, and blue, and he will have a military funeral, and I didn’t want to do anything that would be disrespectful to him . . .

  But what he did definitely pushed the conversation to the forefront, and down the line we will realize how important what he did really was.

  Etan: He specifically said that this wasn’t about the military. It was like the first thing he said. It’s like that didn’t matter.

  Smith: Because people only care about what’s important to them. “I think it’s offensive, so I’m not going to listen to you. In fact, I’m going to call you selfish. And that you’re against America. Even though you didn’t say that.” There are so many things history-wise that I personally wouldn’t have known if it weren’t for him doing that. From . . . talking to my dad about different things that happened in the military in terms of how African Americans were treated, or learning how at Pearl Harbor, Black soldiers were actually segregated in certain spots on that day.

  Etan: You mentioned that down the road people are going to look back and appreciate this more. What do you mean by that?

  Smith: I don’t want to knock anyone who has been progressively in the forefront for many, many years, fighting these battles he has articulated, but what he did was help elevate that to a level that people wanted to reach. Or bring the attention to these issues in a way that people have been trying to for decades . . . Down the line, I think we will be able to appreciate that more as individuals and as an entire society, because things will be affected from the top down because of him.

  Etan: It seems like the fans in San Francisco were pretty supportive for the most part, but San Francisco is also a very progressive place and these are issues that are commonly discussed and fought and addressed on the regular out there. But there were other cities and other fans who were irate.

  Smith: I think that’s exactly what happened, and what’s interesting about this and what I learned from it, there’s never a right way in their eyes to protest. You sit down on the bus in the front, people get mad; you protest and demonstrate and march, people get mad; you riot, people get mad; you take a knee or sit down during the national anthem, people get mad . . . But the way Kap did it, in terms of his actions, it got people talking.

  Etan: You said that you decided not to do it necessarily Kaepernick’s way but that you were going to fight the same fight your own way . . .

  Smith: One of the things me and my wife believe very strongly and what we try to exhibit is taking care of your home and your household first. Educating yourselves and your children and preparing them and then branching out to help the community and mentoring kids and giving them the resources they need . . . After-school programs, computers, new books, technology. And we also teach them the things that people don’t teach them. How to be a man, how to carry yourself.
Knowing yourself, being yourself, and being comfortable in your own skin, and knowing that everyone in society is not going to always treat you the same . . . It’s important because we have to be able to talk to our youth about how they have to react and respond when they interact with the police . . . There are different biases or flat-out racism that we have to deal with. That is just reality.

  Etan: Very true. What are you doing in terms of directly fighting against police brutality?

  Smith: Since Kap has brought that conversation to the forefront, I have been asking myself, What would be a win? How do we win in this situation dealing with the police, because as long as the police officers carry the guns, there will always be deaths? What we have been doing lately is visiting different police academies. Every away game we have been talking to a different police chief of that city to figure out what are they doing, how they are training their officers, so that I can go back and tell other people what they are supposed to be doing. We ask them, “Why don’t you tell the things you are telling us to everyone in the public and in the community? Why is that not being communicated in terms of transparency?” There is a serious lack of trust by the community, for the most part, of the police as a whole . . . and a lot of the reason is the lack of communication and transparency . . . And honestly, certain things should be the same across the board. There needs to be some type of standard, and people need to understand or it needs to be explained to them exactly how the process works.

  Etan: When you talk about what “we” have been doing, is that the team or your foundation?

  Smith: No, this is the team as a whole. Our team owner has set up these meetings at these different police stations in the different cities after Kap took his stance and brought this to the forefront. The team donated a million dollars to grassroots programs who are trying to fight police brutality . . .

  And let me say this: not all of the police departments had good policies, to be quite honest, but the San Jose police chief in particular was very impressive. If you could imagine what would be the ideal way that a police department should be run, he is it. And really, we have all learned a lot. It was good for me to see the good and the bad so that I can relay the information to the community and especially to the youth and say, “In this particular city, this police department has this policy, so you have to know that this is what they do.” It’s vital to have this information. For us to have these team events, and panels on a small level, I’m sure it will continue to grow as we all learn more about this. We will really be able to bring about change because we have communicated to some of the police departments our thoughts and opinions on their policies . . . We are having dialogues with them. And it really was all started by Kap taking that stance.

  Interview with David West

  It’s important to note that Kaepernick isn’t the first modern-day athlete to take a stance of this nature. Like Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf, whose interview appears later in this book, NBA veteran David West is another athlete whose protest actions have been largely forgotten. Many are unaware that David West has subtly been protesting the national anthem for many years, even before Kaepernick. I personally noticed him standing last in line and about three or four feet behind his teammates while the national anthem was being played before games back in 2004 when he was with the New Orleans Hornets. When I would see him, I would let him know that I respected him and the stances he was taking, and he would say the same thing to me. As the years rolled on, I would run into him at panel discussions and different events and hear him express his concerns about a wide range of issues that plague our society. He has a deep passion and articulates the specifics so well that it would leave the crowds mesmerized.

  West took time out of his in-season schedule with the Golden State Warriors to talk with me about some of these particulars. They fall right in line with everything that Kaepernick has so eloquently discussed, and sometimes even go deeper.

  Etan: You have been protesting the national anthem consistently for some time now. It may have gone unnoticed because it wasn’t as drastic as taking a knee like Kaepernick. Talk about your reasons for standing behind the rest of your team during the anthem.

  David West: During my second year in the NBA, we had a team meeting where we were asked by the owner to put our hands over our heart while standing for the national anthem. I raised my hand and simply stated my position. I told them that I wasn’t going to do it . . . So me standing at the end of the line a step or two behind my teammates was something that I did solely because of that meeting. It had nothing to do with some publicized event . . . I wanted to recognize that there is something outside of this world that we are living in called sport or the NBA. That was always a reminder to myself. I see guys go through certain rituals before the game. Well, for me, that was something simple that I could do in that moment to reflect on how lucky I am to be doing something that I love; but at the same time recognizing that there is a greater seriousness to life outside of this little bubble called the NBA.

  Etan: Did anyone attempt to talk you out of it? If so, what was your reaction and what was their reaction? Did you ever fear criticism from the media or fans?

  West: I never feared criticism from the media or fans because I’ve always felt like I speak from a position of clarity. I speak from a perspective of honesty. I try to be as truthful as I possibly can in my declarations. Oftentimes when I speak out, it’s not about me. It’s not about David getting himself out in front of the camera or trying to be a lead activist. When I was outspoken about Donald Sterling and was one of the first people to call it what it was—straight-up racism—there was no other way to palatably express what he said in what he was trying to convey in that message. It was straight slave-plantation ideology and I wasn’t ashamed nor afraid to say that . . . There is this logic that we will somehow lose out or we will be looked at as less-than if we speak about what is happening in society. I think that’s false.

  What I’ve found is that the fans appreciate intelligence. They appreciate the social engagement. It actually makes them feel better that the people they are supporting give a damn about what’s going on in the world. I’ve actually had a greater response from people who appreciate athletes saying positive things because they know the type of weight our words carry with young people. Teachers are some of the biggest supporters. I’ve heard them say, “Thank God you said what you said,” “I appreciate your words,” etc. That’s a constant I hear, because they appreciate us showing a different dimension . . . Now there is hope that you don’t have to be one-dimensional. You don’t solely have to be a dumb jock. You can read books, you can be socially and politically engaged . . . In order to present the greatest version of yourself, you must have different dimensions to who you are. Your professional experience, your personal experience, your societal experience, and your ability to critically think and express your thoughts through language help convey your message . . .

  When it all comes down to it, you cannot be afraid to speak your truth, particularly when it comes to historical context. You cannot be afraid to tell history as it actually occurred, not what we want to feel about it, and not what we want to extrapolate from it or revise it . . . That in total is why I speak and why I don’t have a fear of being criticized.

  Etan: Here’s a quote from a powerful interview you did with the Undefeated: “I can’t start talking about civility and being a citizen if [you] don’t even think I’m a human being. How can you talk about progress and how humans interrelate with one another when you don’t even recognize our humanity? We got to somehow get that straight first so we’re on the same playing field.” Those are powerful words. Can you talk about this in more detail?

  West: I believe historical context is the most important context in this nation as it pertains to African Americans, African people in America, Black people, colored people, Negroes, people of color, or whatever other name or term that you want to endear to us. The root of all of these issues isn’t just slavery. A lot of
times people on both sides say we use the slavery card . . . When we are talking about police brutality, for-profit prisons, prisoner slavery, the death penalty, death row, undereducation, miseducation, mass incarceration, all of the different civic and social issues that we deal with as a group, in this country in particular and in most places around the world, you’re going to find us at the bottom . . .

  All of the socioeconomic indicators indicate that our group is lacking the most in this country. And those same socioeconomic indicators can be cut, copied, and pasted, and put on Black people in just about every other part of the world. We already know the degree to which Africa itself has been looted, destroyed, and robbed for hundreds of years continuously . . . The constant rape of the resources and the consistent torture and torment of the citizens of Africa mainly rest on this idea that we are not a part of the human family.