Nathan J Gordon, William L Fleisher
Page 41
“How and why” solutions allow the guilty suspect to admit to a lesser act and blame
the victim, minimizing the crime and motivations for the crime. The interrogator moves
the suspect from his initial position of “Nothing happened” toward the final goal. Upon
getting a minor admission, the interrogator should take a statement (unless state law
does not allow for continued interrogation after a statement is taken) of the suspect’s
new position, and then start again with the ten key aspects. In other words, if you can’t
obtain an immediate full confession, accept a partial or minor admission and use that as
}O’Grady was convicted and received life imprisonment without the possibility of parole. Interestingly,
while speaking to a county criminal bar association, one of the authors was congratulated by a man who
identified himself as O’Grady’s attorney for doing a “great job” in that case.
10. MOVE IN CLOSE AND PRESS FOR THE CONFESSION
275
a new starting point for further interrogation. Interrogators counsel truth. Being a good
counselor, the interrogator needs to convince the suspect that it is in the suspect’s best
interest to tell the truth. Remember, the interrogator must make the subject aware that
telling the truth does something for him, not for the interrogator. People behave based
on their own self-interest. Therefore, it’s incumbent on the interrogator to come from a
supportive position in making the case for telling the truth.
The following are some arguments for telling the truth:
1. “John, they didn’t pick your name out of a hat. You have to recognize the evidence
piling up against you and that the best resolution is to immediately put this behind you
by telling the truth. Don’t fight the inevitable. Fight for the best possible outcome for
you. That’s where your energy belongs!”
2. “There isn’t anything you can say that will shock me. The worst things that humans do
are understandable. The most disappointing thing you can do in this room is lie to me.
So, if you have any intent to lie to me, I’d rather you say nothing at all.”
3. “John, only a coward hides behind a lie. I think you’re a man. Please let me help you by
proving to me I’m right. Be man enough to tell the truth.”
4. “You know, John, what you are telling me is like being a little bit pregnant. What
you’ve told me so far makes you pregnant, so why don’t you tell me the whole truth
right now?”
5. “I don’t want to know if you did it or not. I already know that. I just want to know why
you did it so I can help you explain this.”
6. “Right now John, your life is like a new pair of shoes you’re wearing, and you just
stepped in some dog crap. Now there are two things you can do. You can throw your
new shoes away, or you can wipe off all the crap and start out fresh again. It may be a
little messy, but the outcome is much better. John, do you want to throw your life away,
or clean it up and start out new?”
7. “John, nobody thinks you’re Jeffrey Dahmer. You are a human being like the rest of us,
full of strengths and weaknesses. We all have done things we are not proud of, things
we wouldn’t want our families to know about. So what! Tell me the truth now and let
me help you. It’s how you live the rest of your life that’s important.”
8. “John, you’re just a person who made a mistake. I bet if you could turn the clock back
and not have done this, you would turn it back right now, wouldn’t you? But nobody
can do that, so let’s help rectify the mistakes and help yourself the best way you can by
telling me the truth.”
9. “John, I know a good person like you must have been under a great deal of pressure to
make you do something like this. We have all been under this type of pressure, and
I can understand it was due to pressure that you did this, wasn’t it?”
10. “John, right now you are at the crossroads of your life. You are the only one who can
decide whether you are going to take the road of a criminal, or the road of a person who
just made a mistake and wants to correct it. Tell the truth and start over again with
another chance. John which road do you want to take?”
11. “If I showed you a picture of your mother, John, and told you it wasn’t your mother,
you wouldn’t believe me, would you? No matter how long or hard I talked to you,
I wouldn’t be able to convince you it wasn’t a picture of your mother, would I? You
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18. THE INTEGRATED INTERROGATION TECHNIQUE
know why? Because you know what your mother looks like, don’t you? Well, I have a
picture here. A picture composed of facts and evidence. A picture of your lie. And I
know what that picture looks like because I’ve been doing this many years and have a
lot of experience and training. I’ve seen the picture before. No matter what you say to
me, you’ll never be able to convince me that you didn’t do this. So, why not tell me the
truth and let me help you explain to others why it happened?”
12. “You want to leave? Let me tell you something, John, that door knob turns both ways,
and if you don’t stop fooling around and start telling me the truth, I’m going to leave
and let you handle this mess yourself.”
13. “Tell me why you’re afraid to tell the truth. Are you afraid of being punished? Do you
remember when you were a kid, and you did something wrong? When you told the
truth, you were punished, and when your parents found out about it themselves, you
were punished. Weren’t you punished much worse when you lied than when you told
the truth?”
14. “John, you can lie to me, you can lie to your family, you can lie to your friends, but you
can’t lie to yourself, and you can never lie to Him.” (Points up toward heaven)
15. “John, do you think you’re the first person in the world who ever made a mistake?
Well, you’re not. But, you have a choice now to correct that mistake and start over, or
compound it. The choice is yours. Do you want to tell me the truth?”
16. “Your lying is only delaying the inevitable. John, the truth is going to come out, and if it
comes out later it’s going to hurt you. Don’t you think it would be much better for you
to tell the truth now and let me help you?”
17. “John, if you were my own brother I’d give you the same advice I’m giving you now.
Tell the truth and get it off your chest, because it’s the right thing to do.”
18. “Now is the time to cooperate. You are lucky. Tonight I need your help, but tomorrow
I won’t. You only get one bite of the apple. So, take a minute to think about it, then tell
me what really happened, because it’s your last chance to cooperate.”
19. “John, since this has happened you probably feel like you have a rock on your chest.
Every time you see a police car your heart starts pounding, because you think it’s for
you. Now is the time to put those fears to rest. Now is the time to get that rock off your
chest. Now is the time to tell the truth.”
20. “John, we live in a psychological society, not a legalistic one. You have two people who
do the same crime. One goes before the judge, says he knows what he did was wrong,
that he’s sorry and it won’t happen again. The other looks the judge in the
eyes, and
says he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. One gets released on his recognizance,
and one goes to jail. Which do you want to be? John: tell the truth.”
A good interrogator must enjoy the challenge, the mental contest between himself and
the suspect. He must be able to put everything else happening in his life on hold and focus
only and entirely on the task at hand. Even if the interrogator is well intentioned, has a
strong work ethic, truly believes in truth, and employs the ten key aspects, he will never
get every guilty suspect to confess unless he believes that he can get the next guilty suspect
he interrogates to confess. If he does not have this belief, then it is time for him to step aside
and let someone else do the job!
SUMMARY
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SUMMARY
TEN KEY ASPECTS TO OBTAINING A CONFESSION:
1. Make a firm statement the person is guilty.
2. Do not allow the person to deny the act.
3. Offer possibilities of how and why this may have happened.
4. Undermine the person’s self-confidence.
5. Offer persuasive arguments for telling the truth.
6. Offer solutions, if possible, to alleviate the person’s fears.
7. Compliment the person.
8. Use leading and alternative type questions.
9. Watch for the “buy” signs.
10. Move in close and press for the confession.
Reference
[1] P.C. McGraw, Life Strategies, Hyperion, New York, 1999.
C H A P T E R
19
Statements, Recordings, and Videos
An individual was viewing the videotape of an actual interrogation of a man accused by
his 3-year-old daughter and 2-year-old son of sexually molesting them. She found the
details of the sexual molestation sickening. She considered the crime horrendous. The
Integrated Interrogation Technique was employed. The interrogator never raised his voice.
He never cursed or threatened the suspect with physical harm. The videotape showed him
sitting in the interrogation and calmly and persistently repeating the ten key steps in the
process, until the suspect confessed.
The viewer shut the VCR off, turned and stated, “That confession was coerced! You men-
tally beat that poor guy up!”
That “poor guy” was the suspect who had just confessed to sexually forcing his daughter
and son to have vaginal and anal intercourse with him! He was at liberty to end the inter-
rogation at any time. He was free to ask for legal assistance at any time. He confessed out of
his own volition and his own need.
Perhaps the viewer was just naı¨ve. She thought a criminal interrogation consisted of just
telling the “bad guy” you knew he did it, and the “bad guy” just saying, “Okay, you got
me.” Anything else, to her way of thinking, was coercion.
In another example, one of the authors had just given testimony at the criminal trial of a
man who had beaten his fianceé’s 6-year-old daughter to death. He had confessed to how
he was watching the little girl for his fianceé and how she began to cry for her mother.
When the child wouldn’t stop crying, he sent her to her bedroom. She would not stay there
and kept coming to the living room where he was watching television. He finally “back-
fisted” her in the head. He could not understand why she cried even louder now. He
picked her up and carried her to her bedroom and threw her down on the bed. She started
to get up, so he punched her in the chest. She continued crying, so he grabbed her by her
thighs and slammed her head into the baseboard on the wall. She started shaking uncon-
trollably, went into a coma, and later died.
The author had allowed a detective from the municipality to sit in on the interrogation.
After the confession he left and allowed the detective to take the written statement. Later, at
the confessor’s judicial proceedings, the detective was testifying. The defendant’s attorney
asked him if the confession was tape-recorded. The author was surprised to hear the detec-
tive say that after the author had left the room a tape recorder had been used to take the
Effective Interviewing and Interrogation Techniques
279
# 2011, Elsevier Ltd.
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19. STATEMENTS, RECORDINGS, AND VIDEOS
murderer’s statement. The attorney requested the detective play the tape for the jury. Now
the tape and its contents became the issue, not the crime and the suspect.
One of the most infamous cases involving the negative affects of videotaping was the
Bernhard Goetz case. Goetz, if you remember, on December 22, 1984, gunned down four
black youths on a New York City subway. He successfully fled the crime scene, but later
turned himself in. During his police interview, he made some interesting statements as well
as some conflicting ones. The authors understand that the four shot individuals were not
“saints.” The question asked is not whether these four men deserved to be shot, but
whether if you were the detective interviewing and interrogating Goetz, could you have
testified to the following and successfully convicted him?
Your testimony is that Goetz said:
1. He had gotten on the subway to go to meet friends for a drink.
2. He contradicted that statement by saying he was doing a work project, got tired, and
decided to go downtown for a drink.
3. He noticed an empty subway car. He did not know why it was empty, so he got on.
4. Later, he contradicted this by saying that all New Yorkers know that an empty subway
car means bad asses are on it and emptied the car. “New Yorkers are not stupid!”
5. Upon entering the car, he observed four black youths. One approached him and asked
him if he had five dollars.
6. Goetz said he had been in situations like this before, when pulling his unlicensed gun
was enough, but this time he snapped because he could tell by the youth’s smile and
glean in his eyes he thought it was funny and intended to play with him (Goetz). He said
he knew the youths were unarmed. He said, “This time I just snapped.”
7. Two of the youths were on each side of him. He had practiced combat shooting before.
He knew he was going to fire from right to left, aiming for center mass.
8. He asked the youth to repeat what he said. After that, he said to the youth, “I’ll give you
five dollars,” and opened fire on them. He said he intended to kill them all, and if they
were still alive, it was God’s decision, not his. After shooting them all, he looked down at
one of the wounded youth and said, “You look like you’re doing all right,” and shot him
again. He then fled.
If you were the investigator and testified to this, would Goetz have been convicted? We
think he would have. However, after the jury watched the videotape of Goetz’s confession,
as you may know, they found him not guilty! According to posttrial interviews of the jur-
ors, it was the videotape, which the prosecution thought was the “jewel” of their case, that
led to his acquittal. What the jurors saw in the video was a poor, tired, somewhat angry
man who was just trying to tell the truth about his ordeal. The sympathy factor outweighed
the contradictions in Goetz’s statements and the facts of the case.
The questio
n is often asked: “Should interviews and/or criminal interrogations be
videotaped or tape-recorded?” Understanding that the pendulum is swinging toward
videotaping all interviews, the authors, however, believe they should not be recorded.
The interview and interrogation are only two parts of a very long and complex investiga-
tive process. To concentrate on the interview alone is to isolate critical parts of the
process and examine them out of context of the full investigation and the entire body of
evidence.
19. STATEMENTS, RECORDINGS, AND VIDEOS
281
The authors agree that suspects should enjoy all the guarantees provided by the Consti-
tution and applicable legislation. Given that, the process of obtaining the confession should
not become the issue; rather, the confession itself should be evaluated as part of the
evidence.
Moreover, to record the interview but not the interrogation, or vice versa, would raise the
question of what was done to a suspect in one of the processes outside of the taping.
The knowledge that the public could view all interviews and the interrogation would put
the investigator in an untenable situation. On one hand, anyone interviewed would know
that his privacy might be violated or that he might unwittingly have violated his own Fifth
Amendment rights, because there would be no degree of confidentiality or ability to remain
off the record in unrelated matters. On the other hand, recording would afford some devi-
ant sociopathic individuals the opportunity to “perform” for the tape in anticipation of the
trial. Under those circumstances, few would allow themselves to be interviewed or interro-
gated except those who wanted to manipulate the process. Some people, if being taped,
would be reluctant to cooperate by naming names from fear of being known as a “rat.”
Given that, taping of any kind seems to attack the truth-gathering process rather than
help it.
In a self-report questionnaire completed by 631 police investigators on their beliefs and
practices concerning interrogation, 81% believed the process should be recorded [1]. In
another study of 112 investigators, it was reported that when these recordings were done
with hidden cameras, the confession rate was twice as high as when the cameras were