The Climb

by Anatoli Boukreev

  SANDY: He’s jumping ahead.

  ANATOLI: Excuse me. How many bottles Scott have oxygen?

  LOPSANG: He had three bottles please, yeah.

  ANATOLI: Three.

  KLEV: How many?

  LOPSANG: He had two bottles before.

  KLEV: Two bottles—

  LOPSANG: And, so one Sherpa give to him and Sherpa going to pass—[UI]—

  ANATOLI: In summit he go with oxygen?

  LOPSANG: Yeah, with oxygen.

  KLEV: And at South Summit he passed a Sherpa that gave him another bottle?

  LOPSANG: Yeah.

  KLEV: So he had the two he carried up and then a Sherpa gave him a third one?

  LOPSANG: Yeah.

  SANDY: And what was the flow rate? Do we know? Does anybody—I mean, did he mention it or did you see it?

  LOPSANG: He’s very sick.

  SANDY: Yes, but what number was the flow of his oxygen? Did you see it?

  LOPSANG: No, we don’t see. So, we have all full oxygen bottle—[UI]— one hundred fifteen, one hundred twenty—[UI].

  KLEV: I wanted to jump back—this is Klev—to the fixing of the lines again, because there was some mention that, from either Anatoli or Lopsang, I’ve forgotten now, that it was Neal’s responsibility to be up there, and I personally followed Neal—

  [GAP ON RECORDING]*

  KLEV:—have any indication, make any indication to me that he was supposed to be up there. So I’m a little confused there, and think there’s some clarification in order.

  NEAL: It was not my understanding that I was to fix lines. It was my understanding from Scott that I was to be in the middle of the pack and try to organize and help as many people as possible, just continue up the mountain. The reason that I started fixing lines from basically taking the initiative to move forward and to get into position to fix lines from the Southeast Ridge was that I looked at my watch at that time and it seemed that we were very slow based on the cutoff times that Rob Hall had recommended. They weren’t stringent, but it just seemed that we were behind and that there was no organization up front. From the Southeast Ridge, I remember yelling back to people to hurry up and not wait too long. I followed Lopsang and Ang Dorje, a Sherpa from the Rob Hall expedition, up over the first little bulge. Klev was behind me. We made a new trail off to the left which was a little safer, broke through some deep snow up to a bench. Lopsang was there; he was very sick and vomiting. From there I took three ropes? from? two ropes? two long ropes?

  LOPSANG: [UI].

  NEAL: Ah, I took two ropes from Lopsang, a very long white polypropylene rope and maybe sixty meters of 7 mil. Perlon rope. And I don’t recall—did I take an oxygen bottle from you or no? Yes? No. I did not there. We continued up. Ang Dorje fixed, but we climbed some more. Ang Dorje fixed one rope. After that I took out the long white polypropylene rope and fixed another long pitch and dug out the remaining ropes to the South Summit. I arrived there, according to my watch, at exactly 9:58 [A.M.]. I remember looking because Rob’s cutoff time was about ten o’clock at the South Summit, that I recall. And I thought, boy, we’re getting late, and was very antsy. Martin followed me up to the South Summit. He was the second person there, probably trailing me by, I’m guessing, a half an hour. I was on the South Summit for roughly one hour, and then moved down below the South Summit behind the rock where everybody sat to watch the traverse. I was there for approximately forty-five minutes. I recall looking around at the Sherpas that were there and none of our Sherpas were there and Ang Dorje was either tired, sick, or didn’t want to fix. I looked at Anatoli—

  KLEV: To fix across the—

  NEAL: To fix to the summit. I looked at Anatoli and thought we better get going. I yelled at Andy Harris, a guide from Rob Hall’s expedition, if he would help.* We [Beidleman and Boukreev] took the Perlon rope that I had, unfurled it, and Anatoli and I started across the ridge.

  KLEV: This is Klev. You made some references to turnaround times, and I’m wondering what kind of discussions you and Scott and Anatoli had in regard to those?

  NEAL: The discussions that I had with Scott was that I was to be in the middle of the pack, and I thought Anatoli would be up in front, fixing ropes, which he did from the South Summit on, and Scott was to be sweep. And Scott would make all the hard decisions about who could continue and who had to turn around, as a function of his leadership role, and I wasn’t comfortable telling somebody on the expedition at that point that they had to turn around when they may have thought they had a chance to continue on. So, I just pushed forward, knowing that, at least from the position I was in, I felt comfortable getting down. I didn’t think it was too late. I knew I could move fast and essentially felt that the responsibility for turning people around was behind me and not at me. Either I could push the route forward or I could stay there as a tollgate and turn people around. If Anatoli and I had not gone forward, no one would have made the summit; everybody would have been stacked up at the South Col and that would have been the end of the game anyway.

  [GAP ON RECORDING]

  LENE: My personal way of being in this group has all the way been trust yourself, trust yourself, trust yourself, because I haven’t heard anything about this. Then—and I have a question to the guides, and that is: Everybody, before we even started out toward the summit bid, leaving the South Col, was talking about that Lopsang was extremely sick. Who the hell is responsible for keeping a Sherpa off the mountain who’s vomiting, maybe because of altitude, instead of sending him on the mountain? I don’t understand that. I would never have done that.

  SANDY: With all this discussion, we’ve not said anything about Scott’s whereabouts. Did anybody—up to the chronology that we’ve got to this point—did anybody see Scott?

  LENE: No.

  TIM: Halfway up the first fixed line, above the Southeast Ridge—this is Tim—I stopped and I looked back because everybody was stacked up there and nobody was moving. And, I made a count of approximately thirty people who were coming up, and I was curious where Scott was, so I did look around for him, and I thought I saw him maybe about the same spot where Lopsang was sitting and was sick earlier.

  SANDY: Lopsang, did you climb with Scott? Before the summit? Before the summit, not after the summit. But, before the summit?

  ANATOLI: No.

  SANDY: Did you climb with Scott or did you see Scott?

  LOPSANG: No.

  ANATOLI: No, he was very behind I think. I tried to see him, but I didn’t saw him. I didn’t see him also. And very I understand, uh, Scott, because very difficult to make exactly plan. Sometime situation tell for you what you need to do. And very difficult to make sure plan about who will fix line, what is time, because it is depended of weather, depended how you feel, necessary discuss about. I, many time, I try to stop and wait [for] Scott and make some questions for him because for me, also, I didn’t understand many things on this last attempt. And, maybe he get some sickness; it is also possible. Also he believe for Neal, for me, we can to do this with Neal. With Neal—I met Neal before, when he go forward to fix line, after 8,500 meters.— The last time when I saw Scott come. Scott felt—his look was okay, not questions, little behind of group, but I don’t understand he— maybe he felt not so very well.*—And, then Neal go forward; we little discuss with him. Neal said he will go with Ang Dorje, the sirdar of Rob Hall expedition, and he go to fix line, and he work with oxygen. I have some extra bottle, so I gave him if he will need for hard job. And South Summit, we get probably—what is time, Neal?

  NEAL: South Summit I arrived at ten o’clock [10:00 A.M., May 10, 1996].

  ANATOLI: And I didn’t see [fixed ropes], because, before also, Scott told me maybe Sherpas will fix line; it is not difficult. But I didn’t see nothing, [no] initiative from nobody. I told Neal, “You will belay me and I go to forwards.” Then I saw some two guides from Rob Hall expedition go behind me with long rope.

  NEAL: Actually, one was a guide, Anatoli. Andy Harris [was a guide], and the other
[was] a client, Jon Krakauer.

  ANATOLI: Yeah, but strong climbers, I think.

  NEAL: Yes.

  ANATOLI: And very simple way, we didn’t fix line, because I think behind somebody will make this simple, and I go for difficult place and we make this very fast, I think, not so difficult, not so long time, we make very fast. And after Hillary Step is one also little steep place, but with crampon, with ice ax, not so difficult. Our ropes is finished. We go to summit and—

  NEAL: Actually, from there, Anatoli, I stopped and got the rope from Jon Krakauer, because I wanted to fix that section because of the wind.

  ANATOLI: [Wind] began.

  NEAL: Yes, Andy [Harris] and Jon [Krakauer] asked if they could go around me because their oxygen was low.* I said, “Fine.” I uncoiled the rope. It was very long, maybe a hundred meters. Martin was below me. I asked Martin if he would help me pay out the rope and tie the end to [an] anchor, which he did. I started up. I made it maybe twenty or thirty feet, until the rope caught in the rocks. I had to come back a little bit and wait. Martin finally helped me untangle the rope from the rock. I continued up to a snow stake, tied off the rope. There, the remaining forty or fifty meters, I walked up further to fix. I didn’t find another anchor. We didn’t have anchors with us because we thought that the Sherpas would. It didn’t appear to be my job earlier to think about bringing anchors as well. I got to the end of the rope and I didn’t want to leave my ice ax because it was still steep and I wanted to self-arrest. I threw the end of the rope off the remaining forty meters into Tibet so no one would grab the rope and think it was fixed and pull up. And then I continued up to the summit and arrived there about 1:25 to 1:30 [P.M.].

  SANDY: Should we just state everybody’s summit times? What they think?

  ANATOLI: Maybe seven minutes past of one o’clock I make summit.

  SANDY: Anatoli was seven minutes past one o’clock. I think I was 2:15 [P.M.].

  NEAL: I was 1:25 to 1:30 [P.M.].

  LENE: I think around 2:30 [P.M.].

  SANDY: Lene around 2:30 [P.M.] on the summit.

  MARTIN: I was with Neal. I don’t know what time it was.

  SANDY: Martin was with Neal.

  KLEV: This is Klev. I was approximately a half hour behind Neal.

  INGRID: I’d say about two o’clock.

  TIM: This is Tim. I think Tim and Charlotte summited about 2:20, 2:25 [P.M.].

  SANDY: You were ahead of me, so either I’m wrong or—

  TIM: Well, within five minutes of each other.

  SANDY: You guys were ten minutes ahead of me.

  TIM: Between 2:15 and 2:30 [P.M.] is when I think the four of us put it.

  SANDY: Yeah, and, Lopsang, what time did you get on the summit?

  LOPSANG: Same.

  SANDY: We were at the same time.

  LOPSANG: Same time—[UI].

  TIM: You were ahead of us.

  LENE: I always thought we were very close together at that point; that’s true, yeah.

  LOPSANG: Summit to come back, so I’m 4:30 [P.M.]—

  LENE: Yeah.

  KLEV: This is Klev. I’m maybe fifteen minutes behind Neal—correction. —I have a question for Anatoli: What time did you leave Camp IV?

  ANATOLI: From Camp IV?

  KLEV: Yes.

  ANATOLI: Twelve o’clock.

  KLEV: And who did you climb with, Anatoli, from Camp IV to Southeast Ridge?

  ANATOLI: Martin first time; then he go—

  KLEV: You climbed with Martin from Camp IV to Southeast Ridge?

  ANATOLI: Yes.

  LENE: And I saw Anatoli. He was sometimes behind me, sometimes in front of me.

  anatole I saw people—very stability—[UI].

  KLEV: How about if we talk a little about radios and radio placement?

  SANDY: That’s a good idea.

  KLEV: Where they were and who had ‘em?

  SANDY: Who had a radio? Did you have a radio?

  KLEV: Lopsang, did you have a radio?

  LOPSANG: Yeah, a small one.

  INGRID: A small yellow one.

  KLEV: What color?

  LOPSANG: Yellow.

  SANDY: You had my—one of my small yellow radios.

  LOPSANG: Yeah, yeah—[UI]—only Scott had one.

  KLEV: Scott had one of the small yellow radios?

  SANDY: And Scott had a small yellow radio.

  KLEV: And you had one?

  INGRID: How did you?—

  LOPSANG: I give you?—[UI]

  SANDY: Yeah.

  INGRID: How did you talk to Pemba?

  LENE: Did any of the other guides have a radio or any arrangements for radio contact with the expedition leader?

  NEAL: I did not. Originally, Scott and I were going to split the radios, but no specific arrangement was made for me to have the radio. We were going to have a radio at the front of the pack and the back of the pack, and we assumed Lopsang would be at the front and Scott at the back. When I passed Lopsang, at the altitude and under the circumstances, it didn’t occur to me to grab the radio.

  INGRID: So, Lopsang, you had a black radio and a yellow radio?

  LOPSANG: Yes—[UI].

  INGRID: And when I talked to you on the summit, you were talking on the black—?

  LOPSANG: Yeah, black one.

  SANDY: And only Sherpa had black radios?

  LOPSANG: What I had—other Sherpa had—[UI].

  SANDY: You had no radio, Anatoli?

  ANATOLI: No.

  INGRID: You had the only black radio that could communicate with the other camps?*—Okay.

  KLEV: Jumping back to the protection. Lopsang, you carried some fixed ropes. Did you have any ice-screws or any slings or any—?

  LOPSANG: Every year we carry only rope and we find some other rope and other rope we—

  KLEV: You and other Sherpas carry only rope? No ice-screws, slings, or—protection?

  ANATOLI: For this route, Klev, we don’t need ice-screws—

  LOPSANG: Ice-screws we don’t need to go up.

  ANATOLI: Never people like—I talk with Rob Hall—never people used ice-screws.

  KLEV: Never need ice-screws—

  LOPSANG: So, we carry—

  KLEV: Neal, did you think that the “Sherps” had some?

  NEAL: Well, I was—I didn’t know. I just assumed that they would— they know the route and would take care of whatever equipment necessary to fix the route.

  KLEV: Uh-huh.

  NEAL: And that does vary, not only from year to year, but what time within the expedition season you go up. If other groups have gone before you, much of the route may be fixed. If only an individual or two, or nobody has gone before, then there’s more fixing required. So it was my understanding that the Sherpas would figure out who had been where and what needed to be fixed, and bring the appropriate equipment.

  LENE: And, you’re saying, Lopsang, that all the other years, when you have summited Everest, nobody brings snow stakes, only rope?

  LOPSANG: Yeah, every year we carry only rope. And, after, so we find some snow stakes up. This year so we carry no snow stakes and ice screw, because so the other people there. We no need rope, so we all fixing rope, already. —[UI]—So, already fix rope. They tell them we are. So, we ask, so, already fix rope.

  KLEV: Did anybody understand that?

  LENE: Who told you that the route was already fixed to the summit?

  LOPSANG: Which group that come back? South Summit? May ninth?

  ANATOLI: Maybe Yugoslavian climbed. Also, I heard somebody climbed [to the] South Summit.

  SANDY: Yugoslavians said that the ropes were fixed to the summit already?

  LENE: South Summit.

  LOPSANG: Yugoslavian guide tell to me so—[UI] already fix rope; you no need anything.

  LENE: Okay.

  LOPSANG: And, so we carry one hundred fifty meter rope more up, and I give to two rope Neal, and I taking so after we have problem, some problem. I keep one rope extra my bag
insides and after, so Scott need many rope to come down.

  SANDY: All right. So, we left the summit and—who saw Scott on the summit?

  TIM: I saw him about—Charlotte, Neal, and I, we left the summit about the same time. I don’t know what time it was.* And I think we saw Scott within five minutes of the summit.†

  NEAL: Walking down—five minutes, yeah. That’s about five minutes for him going up.

  SANDY: Right. I saw him at the same time.

  TIM: He was between the Hillary Step and the summit.

  SANDY: Right. That’s when I saw him, too, and I gave him a high five or a thumbs-up. And it was five minutes from the summit for me but perhaps thirty minutes from the summit for him. Is that accurate? Is that anybody else’s experience?

  LENE: I saw Scott on the summit, coming down, and I gave him a hug, and he congratulated me and I said—

  SANDY: You saw him when you were coming down or when he was coming down?

  LENE: When I was coming down, and I said, “I’m tired,” and he told me, “I am very tired.” And then, I went on, because I knew I didn’t want to be alone on that mountain, so I followed Charlotte, Tim, and Neal pretty close.

  KLEV: I’m going to estímate I saw Scott at approximately 2:30, just above the Hillary Step. Does that coincide—?

  SANDY: That would make sense.

  ANATOLI: Yes, I also—

  SANDY: Two-thirty; if I summited at 2:15 [P.M.] and came down then, yeah.

  ANATOLI: I met Scott when was before Hillary Step, before go down this fixed line.

  KLEV: My recollection was that Scott had a mask on. He had an oxygen mask on.

  ANATOLI: Yeah, but—

  KLEV: Whether he had oxygen in his tank or not, I can’t say.

  LENE: What was it that Scott told you when you met him? Because he told you something, me something, and then you something different.

  ANATOLI: First time I met Rob Hall—I saw Rob Hall a little forward than Scott, maybe twenty minutes or fifteen minutes; I don’t remember. And, I talked with Rob Hall how he feel. He said, “Okay, not so big problem.” He said me, “Thank you very much for fix lines.” I ask, “Maybe you need helping for summit?” He said not. Then I met Scott Fischer also. Scott was little slow and with mask—I think with mask—but I don’t know [whether] he use oxygen or not because the mask protect from wind. And, also, little [I] talk with Scott. I talk with Scott how he feel. He said, “Okay, I feel tired.” Maybe little sickness; he don’t understand. I ask him about plan go down, because I come back from summit, began strong wind, very cold. I spent more than one hour on summit. It was very cold, and my point keep myself in maybe—[UI]—and wait, and I ask Scott about what we will do. He said, “Is not problem now; we have time for go down, exactly very soon to summit.” What our plan he tell me, “You need go down and save yourself in South Col and prepare tea.” And, I thought about this; it is good plan because somebody we need to have some reserve, because I didn’t see Sherpa. Sherpa, for Sherpa go to summit, tired, used oxygen. If oxygen will finish, will be some difficult time. And I don’t understand about Sherpa who in South Col, how this people strong, and we talk little bit, like fifteen minutes or ten minutes with Scott about this. And then I go down to South Col. What I—*